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Black parents producing brown puppies

Discussion in 'Sheltie Colors' started by ashriver12, Nov 17, 2013.

  1. ClantyreSheltie

    ClantyreSheltie Forums Sage

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    Sable merle, carrying black. Merle dilution works better on black hair than brown hair. So imagine a heavily black-factored sable, like one with a serious black overlay and black mask over it's head, then randomly dilute it.

    The second series of pictures shows the dog definitely looking sable. The other dog is a regular blue.
     
  2. Jess041

    Jess041 Forums Enthusiast

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    So how did this dog get his championship if he has this fault? And would you breed a dog that had this gene or carried this gene? I ask because Missy's dam has a littermate that was a dilute bi-black, and then Missy's dam must have been a carrier of this gene because she had a dilute bi-black in her first litter. When I think about this, I can't help but wonder why Missy's dam was bred again if they knew she carried the gene. I mean, I'm glad Missy is here and all, but...:confused2:
     
  3. EJHUNTL

    EJHUNTL Forums Enthusiast

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    That sounds right ClantyreSheltie. When the breeder called me to ask if I was interested in taking him, she mentioned that she'd never produced a sable pup with his colouring before ( wish I could recall her name but it was over 20 years ago and she was close to retiring then). He didn't have any of the shade variations/patterns that Dallas my regular blue merle did. It was just that mocha/brown colour over the usual sable, sort of like a tri-colour would be. His grandfather was an agility champion and it showed - he was so fast and could jump anything, at the same time he had the sweetest most sensitive personality and was most definitely my dog. Can't believe I still miss him after all these years.
     
  4. Gina

    Gina Forums Enthusiast

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    A fault is not something that would eliminate you from competition or stop you from receiving points (besides being 50% or more white, but that's another story). There are a TON of faults listed in the Shetland Sheepdog breed standard, and only 2 disqualifications (DQ) which wouldn't allow you to show and would eliminate you from competition. I've copied and pasted all the faults from the AKC standard, so they might seem weird out of context, but I just wanted to show you how many there were.

    Faults-- Light, round, large or too small. Prominent haws.
    Faults-- Set too low. Hound, prick, bat, twisted ears. Leather too thick or too thin.
    Faults-- Two-angled head. Too prominent stop, or no stop. Overfill below, between, or above eyes. Prominent nuchal crest. Domed skull. Prominent cheekbones. Snipy muzzle. Short, receding, or shallow underjaw, lacking breadth and depth. Overshot or undershot, missing or crooked teeth. Teeth visible when mouth is closed.
    Faults-- Too short and thick.
    Faults-- Back too long, too short, swayed or roached. Barrel ribs. Slab-side. Chest narrow and/or too shallow.
    Faults-- Croup higher than withers. Croup too straight or too steep.
    Faults-- Too short. Twisted at end.
    Faults-- Insufficient angulation between shoulder and upper arm. Upper arm too short. Lack of outward slope of shoulders. Loose shoulders. Turning in or out of elbows. Crooked legs. Light bone.
    Faults-- Feet turning in or out. Splay feet. Hare feet. Cat feet.
    Faults-- Narrow thighs. Cow-hocks. Hocks turning out. Poorly defined hock joint.
    Faults-- Coat short or flat, in whole or in part; wavy, curly, soft or silky. Lack of undercoat. Smooth-coated specimens.
    Faults-- Rustiness in a black or a blue coat. Washed-out or degenerate colors, such as pale sable and faded blue. Self-color in the case of blue merle, that is, without any merling or mottling and generally appearing as a faded or dilute tri-color. Conspicuous white body spots. Specimens with more than 50 percent white shall be so severely penalized as to effectively eliminate them from competition.
    Faults-- Stiff, short steps, with a choppy, jerky movement. Mincing steps, with a hopping up and down, or a balancing of weight from side to side (often erroneously admired as a "dancing gait" but permissible in young puppies). Lifting of front feet in hackney-like action, resulting in loss of speed and energy. Pacing gait.
    Faults-- Shyness, timidity, or nervousness. Stubbornness, snappiness, or ill temper.

    Disqualifications-- Heights below or above the desired size range are to be disqualified from the show ring.
    Disqualification-- Brindle.

    Would you rather have a dog with a color that is faulted, or a dog who has a very faulty front and can barely move its way out of a paper bag? As a working breed, I would hope someone would choose the faulty color over the faulty front. How can a dog do it's job when it can't move? Just something to think about.
     
  5. EJHUNTL

    EJHUNTL Forums Enthusiast

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    Ontario, Grand Bend
    Thank you Gina - that totally explains Blue's colouring to me.
     

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