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car chasing/training to stay out of street?

Discussion in 'Behavior' started by Rileys mom, Dec 1, 2013.

  1. trini

    trini Forums Sage

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    There is an article on several doggie related websites that is called "TRUST...A Deadly Disease" that many here may have already read. It is fairly long and may seem a bit "dramatic" in some places, but it is worth reading to the end because it addresses the off lead/on lead issue with heartbreaking clarity.

    Google search will bring up links to this article...or one of its postings can be found at this rescue site:
    http://www.gcnm.org/trust.html
     
  2. take4roll10

    take4roll10 Moderator

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    I'm also with the no-off-leash ground. Dogs have natural instincts, especially herding dogs. You can train your dog until your heart bleeds and your dog can be consistent for years, but all it takes is 1 time for your dog's natural instincts to overpower all it's training and you could end up with a tragedy. I've heard it happen enough times to dogs, so for me, that is not worth the risk.

    There are plenty of ways for dogs to get exercise on leash. I have a 25 foot leash that I use in open fields. Yea, it limits how far I can throw a ball, but it works for my dog. I mainly stick to long daily walks and some fetch in the house.

    For your dog having a great recall in your house, you can control the environment, so your dog will have a higher success rate. Outside, you have no control and there's a lot more temptations.

    I don't have a fenced in yard either (well I do now, but it's small), so I have to walk my dog for every potty break. It sucks, especially when it is cold or raining, but that's the responsibility I took on when I decided to get a dog. I really miss the days of having a nice fenced in back yard.
     
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2013
  3. Mignarda

    Mignarda Forums Enthusiast

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    Wouldn't it be wonderful if we could eliminate all untoward happenings from our lives simply by refusing to take calculated risks?
     
  4. take4roll10

    take4roll10 Moderator

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    Like most decisions in life, you must ask yourself, do the risks outweigh the benefits? So does risking the chance of your dog being hit by a car, chasing an animal and getting lost outweigh running around off-leash? For me, that is not a risk I am willing to take, even if it is a slim risk. For my dog, it is actually not a slim risk. She has a high herding and prey instinct. In the house, her recall is very good, but outside is another story. She will chase motorcycles, squirrels, other dogs, etc. So, no, my dog's life is not something I will risk for a little off-leash time. Especially when there are so many safer alternatives for physical and mental exercise. Obviously, an open field where there are no roads or cars for miles is less risky than a suburban neighborhood, but knowing my dog she would chase a squirrel for miles.

    You know your own dog best, so only you can decide what are the best options for your dog. My dog cannot be trusted off-leash and even if she could be, I would never allow her off-leash near any roads. My dog also eats everything in sight, so knowing her, she would find something poisonous to eat.
     
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2013
  5. SheltieChe

    SheltieChe Forums Sage

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    If you keep calling after you lost his attention it is like throwing chunks of meat to waste:lol:
    Call him at least 10 times every day and reward with various things, including sending him back to whatever he was doing. No off leash until you have seriously great recall. Am not fan of long lines but if one has no choice...
    Neutering won´t help.
    He was born car chaser. You can not have him off leash unless it is secured area.
     
  6. Rileys mom

    Rileys mom Forums Enthusiast

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    I was illogically hoping maybe nuetering would help.

    With your experience, do you think that there is a chance that these could be random incidents and he isn't a car chaser?

    Ever since his car chase I have been feeling almost paranoid that he will get out of the house unleashed when I am at work. He got out once when my brother was getting on the bus but came right back in for mom (hearing about him getting out makes me nervous). Good Riley! He has a good recall unless distracted but I need to work on finding more distractions.

    Everyone else I trust to keep him from getting out but I worry about my brother letting Riley out. He is in kindergarten now but I worry about him going out to play and letting the dogs out in the summer. I need to relax! Its too far away to worry about summer. Hopefully by then I will have a really solid recall in case Riley does get out unleashed and chases something.
     
  7. VallejoSheltie

    VallejoSheltie Forums Enthusiast

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    I have a dog that thankfully isn't a car chaser, or much of anything else outside of squirrels.
    My problem is when taking him out to the car, lately he has had the inclination to run across the street to say hi to random people.

    I also have a shock collar, and while rarely put it on him this year, it has been useful in the past and due to the above I am hoping to use it to train him to not go into the street.

    I happened to have it on him recently at the dog park when a Dobie and another dog got into it. Normally my dog will ignore these incidents and just bring me the ball to kick.
    This time he happened to be a ways away form me, and the 2 dog issue started turning into a pack thing with owners starting to run to the scene.
    My dog has excellent recall, however with the distance and the barking I doubt he could hear me. So I clicked the remote, ... and nothing happened.
    I realized I had it set at his working level of 18/100, which is basically like someone tickling your neck. Quickly ramped it up to 30 and tried again. He gave a little start, looked around for me, and came trotting back just as even more dogs start getting involved and owners were still not even half-way to the dogs.
    When he came back to me, I gave him a 'good boy', and he just sat at my feet and watched the owners wade into their dogs. Then got up and went to find a ball.


    I've only had to use this a couple of times, and really now whenever this is a rowdy dog scene at the park, he will swerve out of the way and usually come trotting back too me.

    For a decently trained dog, I think these are a great way to communicate with your dog when you are either to far away from them, or if need be, to give them that external stimulai which can break through their mental train of thought which is in a heightened state of awareness/anxiety/fear.

    Shock collars nowadays are not about using pain to effect a response. Dogs are often time not willfully disobeying their owners as much as having their brain saturated with stimulation such that our vocal commands just are lost in the noise.
    The shock collar just causes a physical stimuli that breaks through the noise level and allows a command to be received.
    In general, its no more painful, or barbaric than the flea bites a dog receives.

    Whats funny is all the guys who I see at the park who hunt with their dogs. A lot of them use collars when hunting, and honestly their dogs most often are the better behaved ones, better trained and responsive of all.
    And they don't seem to be doing it out of fear.
    Propogating the old school shock collars=torture meme has probably resulted in more dogs dieing because their owners were pursuaded not to use them based on ignorance of proper, common knowledge training.


     
  8. SheltieChe

    SheltieChe Forums Sage

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    Sure for some dogs car chasing is top priority which can not be controlled, just redirected and some dogs will chase but generally it is not their top goal when they outside. However no dog can be trusted around moving cars IMHO
    You can try installing baby gates or instill serious value into your kindergarten kid that no door is to open if puppy is not gated. Also would be thinking that kids and dogs, specifically kid´s friends are not to be left alone with dog unsupervised as a ground rule.
    Teaching Crate Games is a great tool to have as it easily translates into teaching dog not to bolt out of every open door...
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ebjBo_spqG0
     
  9. SheltieChe

    SheltieChe Forums Sage

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    GRRRRR!
    So YOU take your dog to the car off leash and as such provide him opportunity to self reinforce by running to say hi...
    YOU potentially can scare other people who might be afraid of dogs and seeing off leash dog can cause them panic
    YOU did not teach your dog what you want him to do when you go to the car, i.e walk with you and ONLY go visit on a cue ¨go see¨or something like that...
    and YET it is your dog´s problem????? And dog is to be punished? Any punishment for yourself?
    Forget old school, new school, ticking or full stream of electrical activity...
    PUNISHMENT IS A RIGHT TO BE EARNED, not a given privilege of a might
     
  10. Rileys mom

    Rileys mom Forums Enthusiast

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    Thanks SheltieChe for the link to about the crate games! I think I will order her DVD, that will be a great thing to work on this winter:smile2:
     

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