Potty and Crate Training Advice

[521collective]

Hello! Oliver is 9 weeks old now, and is a super smart puppy. He already knows sit, down, and roll over. He has been with us for 2 weeks, and I have been trying to crate train him. I am home all day, so he is usually out with me and in crate for naps and at night time. I am in grad school, and have class in the afternoons for about 3 hours with a break in the middle. I left him yesterday for the longest amount of time so far, 4 hours, and he had his first accident in the crate. He HATES being in his crate, and cries and "screams" until he falls asleep. I don't want the crate situation to be traumatic for him. He wakes up at least 1 time per night to go out, which I would love it if that did not continue. He will go out in the yard with the other dogs to go potty, or I take him out on a leash and he goes potty. This all sounds great, but in between, he just freely goes in the house, even if I had just taken him out. He may only go a teaspoon. Is he already marking territory? I take him out often, usually 2-3 times per hour, if not more. I am just trying not to get frustrated with him. My first sheltie that I had only had 1 accident in the house and was potty trained from then on, so I am inexperienced in this department.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!

[SammysDaddy]

Hi there, I am a new puppy owner as well, so I wouldn't say I am giving you advise but more of an experience sharing. Our puppy girl is always in the crate except when we're actively spending time with her. The first time we do when we take her out of the crate is to visit the potty.

And every time we put her back into the crate, she gets a special treat and she only gets when she goes into the crate to make it a more favorable experience.

[mcemily]

Oh, 521collective... I know how you feel! The Sheltie puppy we had when I was a kid was housebroken in an instant. My current Sheltie... not so much. Shelties are very smart dogs, but even so, some are tougher to housebreak than others. But don't be discouraged. This doesn't really sound like territory marking to me, instead I think it's more that 9 weeks is still very, very young, and accidents are just bound to happen.

One of the puppy training guides I consulted (it was actually the DVD that came with our crate from Midwest Homes) said that as a general rule, puppies can be expected to "hold it" for as many hours as they are months old, plus 1. So, for example, your 9 week old puppy is just over 2 months (8 weeks), so he should probably be able to hold it 3 hours. Again, that's the general rule, and every dog's going to be a little different.

One of the things that the various puppy guides (and other folks on the forum) suggest is to take the puppy out after every change in activity (immediately after eating, after playing, after waking up from a nap, etc.) and to give the puppy only a couple minutes outside to do his business, and if he doesn't do it right away, take him inside and put him in his crate, and try again in a few minutes. Once he does go, then you can let him explore the yard, play with the other dogs, etc. But that's a reward for going potty! If he doesn't go potty, he isn't allowed to play out there! Otherwise he is likely to forget why he went out there in the first place, and when he comes back inside... woops! And, again, if he's had a rollicking play session outside, then before bringing him in, give him another chance to go (since that counts as a change in activity).

Speaking of rewards, if you aren't already rewarding him for pottying outside, do so. When he goes outside, heap praises on him and feed him tasty treats. Throw a party for him! When he goes inside, do not punish, or scold... put him in his crate with a tasty treat and clean up the mess (preferably where he can't see you) with a good enzymatic cleaner. If there is any trace of urine smell left behind, he may keep peeing there because that smell tells him it's a designated potty spot.

As for the issues with his crate... SammysDaddy gave some great advice, by giving your puppy a special treat each time he goes into the crate, to help make it a more pleasant experience. Another thing you can do to help him enjoy his crate more, is to feed him in the crate.

What kind of crate is it? A plastic one that the puppy can hardly see out of, or a wire crate where he can see everything going on around him? Some dogs really prefer one type over the other. We got a wire crate, because we wanted the puppy to be part of what was happening around him, and we reasoned that we could always throw a towel or blanket over it to make it more like a cozy "den" if that's what he seemed to prefer. If your crate is the hard plastic type, try at least turning it so that he can see you... it may be that he feels too isolated in there. If it's a wire type, try putting a blanket over the top and 3 sides and see if that helps.

How big is this crate? You really don't want the crate to be too big for the puppy, because if it is too big, that will invite accidents, because the puppy will use one end as a potty spot, and just hang out in the other end. The crate we got had a divider that came with it, so we could let the crate "grow" along with the puppy. He should have enough room to turn around and lie down, but not much more. Also, if you've got a puppy pad or crate liner in there, take them out for now... they actually make it MORE likely that he'll pee in the crate, as there is something to absorb the urine and he won't have to sit in it afterward, so there is less incentive for him to hold it.

Hang in there... I know it seems like he'll never get it, but trust me... he will! Just in time for him to "forget" it all during the adolescent phase.

[SammysDaddy]

We also give Sammy a jumbo bully stick to keep her occupied while she is in the crate. Unfortunately, since we have a wire cage, the stick keeps falling thru the gap between the wires, and she may lose access to it if we're not around to put it back.

We also have two Kongs, tried putting peanut butter inside, she doesn't seem too interested, so we just put some kibbles in there, the kibble come out too easily though.

[521collective]

Thanks so much Sammysdaddy and mcemily!

I really needed the encouragement! I am rewarding Oliver with treats and praise when he potties outside. I was using treats, but I switched over to cherrios as another thread suggested. I didn't want the treats to add up too fast. He loves the cherrios though!

I am cleaning up his messes indoors with a pet urine cleaner that I am pretty sure is enzymatic, came from Petsmart. I will start putting him out of site when I clean up his mess. That is such a good idea because I think Oliver thinks that it is a game...he always tries to grab my paper towel and run away with it.

I have been feeding him in the crate and started giving him treats when he goes in. It breaks my heart to hear him cry so much, but I guess he will learn eventually? He is getting better at bedtime though. We let him play with the girls (our lab and brittany spaniel), then I hold him for a few minutes to clam him down and he goes right into the crate and falls asleep. I just have no luck with "quiet time" even if I give him a treat. I will have to try the bully sticks though. I can't use kongs because I am severely allergic to rubber. If anyone knows of a plastic or synthetic version of a kong, please let me know! I have looked all over and cannot find one.

Oliver's crate is a wire crate and I have tried it with and without a blanket. When he is napping or asleep at night, I put a blanket over it, but if I have to leave to run errands or something, I leave the blanket off so he can see the other dogs. I have had a blanket in the crate, and he has had accidents, so I may take it out. Do you just leave them on the bare plastic? If he can see plastic, he tries to scratch his way out.

I know he will get it sooner or later, I just prefer it to be sooner

I really appreciate all or your advise!

[Shelby's mom]

I understand your frustration. Our first Sheltie was house broken and had the run of the house by 4 months of age. Shelby on the other hand is 3 years (almost) and we still crate her when we go to work. Shelby was much more difficult to house train and took 6 mos to a year to fully trusted.

Our biggest problem was she didn't know how to tell us she had to go. So we started using the bells on the door and that worked very well. Now she goes to the door and cries to go out.

For the crate Shelby would scream and bark like crazy. Everyone kept telling us to just ignor it. I know how difficult that is but it got better every day and I am glad we stuck it out. Now every day at 6am she is begging us to put her in her "house". We always give her a treat when she goes in along with her stuffed bunny. If the neighborhood kids wouldn't play basketball in the street in front of our house we wouldn't crate her at all. But when they are out there she just goes nuts at the windows barking and jumping and I am afraid she will get hurt doing this.

Hang in there and don't give in. It really does get better.

[Minniesmom15]

Just wanted to say there are some great tips in here, I am bringing my puppy home tomorrow and need to keep all these things in mind! Good luck with your puppy, Oliver is a very cute name!