ClantyreSheltie
Forums Sage
Ah, and the famous dilute.
Color Headed White?
- Thread starter Gina
- Start date
I talked to a friend of mine who is a genetics guru (she has an awesome website http://www.doggenetics.co.uk and it's listed on the VetGen website). She said, "Personally I'd take that link with a pinch of salt! It's based on observations rather than genetic fact, with no studies to back it up. The author also uses horse terms to describe dog colours, which is entirely misleading, and claims that double merle can affect internal organs, which is another idea taken from horse genetics that is not applicable to dogs."
At the moment, we are talking about testing the dam to see if she is in fact a cryptic merle. She has no sign on merle on her, but my friend said although it's unusual for there to be no visible merle, it can happen. And if she isn't a merle, we will discuss it more.
Does anyone know where to test for merle? VetGen apparently doesn't offer it as it's "patented elsewhere".
At the moment, we are talking about testing the dam to see if she is in fact a cryptic merle. She has no sign on merle on her, but my friend said although it's unusual for there to be no visible merle, it can happen. And if she isn't a merle, we will discuss it more.
Does anyone know where to test for merle? VetGen apparently doesn't offer it as it's "patented elsewhere".
HopeShelties
Forums Enthusiast
I would be highly surprised if the dam of this pup is a cryptic merle. The pup is colored like a harlequin dane. My pup was very similar and I know for certain her dam was not a cryptic merle. Mom was tri factored sable with no blue behind hrt.
ClantyreSheltie
Forums Sage
Well, yeah, 45+ years of observation in the breed... Are any of her observations patently incorrect?
You aren't going to get those nice dark merles from the dog you bred to or any other heavily white/black spotted dog, you are going to get lightly colored, strangely marked merles. There is certainly a hierarchy, and I think the LACK of dark merles in our breed proves that out fairly soundly. Look at old merle pictures compared to what we have now. There are a few of the snowflake merles left, but not many.
The merle gene is unstable, and from my recollection, the genetic test for it didn't really work. Good luck if you can find it, I'd be interested in the results, but I think you got exactly what is expected (or what I would expect) out of that particular breeding.
ClantyreSheltie
Forums Sage
I've also seen overly-white merles out of Wintergreen. Tiger Rag was light, but is more fully colored.
HopeShelties
Forums Enthusiast
Clantyre put that really well.
A friend of mine still has a line of the very dark merles. It was sad to see two of the old girls who were the dark colors die last year. 16.5 and 17 respectively. They were both pigeon blues. She still has two from them. Of course, these older girls weren't from any big show lines. I also personally have an older style pewter colored bitch with the snowflake pattern. Not nearly as flashy, but much more correct. She's by a ch son of dury voe zydeco and blue heavens kaltrav ashley.
A friend of mine still has a line of the very dark merles. It was sad to see two of the old girls who were the dark colors die last year. 16.5 and 17 respectively. They were both pigeon blues. She still has two from them. Of course, these older girls weren't from any big show lines. I also personally have an older style pewter colored bitch with the snowflake pattern. Not nearly as flashy, but much more correct. She's by a ch son of dury voe zydeco and blue heavens kaltrav ashley.
I've heard the great merle debate a few times now and I don't want to get into that in this thread 
All I can say is that color is not my number one priority when breeding dogs. If you don't have the structure, then I don't want you in my breeding program. I wouldn't throw away a merle dog with nice structure because someone thinks his merle is incorrect.
I will let you guys now if I can get ahold of this merle test. Before I do that though, I want to make sure this little girl will be able to hear and see before I get too worked out about what color she is.
I had never heard of what you are referring to as a "Harlequin" Sheltie, but putting the name aside, yes it makes sense with the pedigree that this could happen. Let's just all hope she will be okay. Everyone hit 2 weeks old today and everyone has eyes, so I'm thankful for that!
All I can say is that color is not my number one priority when breeding dogs. If you don't have the structure, then I don't want you in my breeding program. I wouldn't throw away a merle dog with nice structure because someone thinks his merle is incorrect.I will let you guys now if I can get ahold of this merle test. Before I do that though, I want to make sure this little girl will be able to hear and see before I get too worked out about what color she is.
I had never heard of what you are referring to as a "Harlequin" Sheltie, but putting the name aside, yes it makes sense with the pedigree that this could happen. Let's just all hope she will be okay. Everyone hit 2 weeks old today and everyone has eyes, so I'm thankful for that!