AKC vs KC Standard

[Caro]

In fact, there are marked differences between US Shelties and UK Shelties...all you have to do is look at photos of the two side by side. The British variety is finer boned, with a narrower, more pointed muzzle. Do they still look like Shelties? Yes. It really becomes a matter or preference, and whether you believe the argument that the US lines carry more genetic problems. There's a huge interest overseas in importing US Shelties, and numerous overseas breeders can be found at our National looking for dogs to buy. Unless we see a flood of European judges in our rings, I don't see that judging to our standard will be a problem here. The hue and cry seems to come from England, more than our side of the pond.

According to his breeder, Deska was bred to UK standards but he's heavy boned, heavy coated has a longer body. He looks distinctly like an American line. So are people really sure that there is enough of a maintainable, set in stone distinction to create 2 different breeds? If US shelties are made into a separate breed they will be fazed out in other countries Shelties are not popular enough outside the US to carry two distinct types. I think it would be sad to cut off the US gene pool, next there will be toy shelties. Funny thing though, imports are more often coming from Scandanavian countries because the UK lines are considered unhealthy.

I'm curious as to why the judge did judge it against American standards at a UK show. Unless it was American, but really had the UK standard. Darn, I'm going to have to find a photo.

He didn't judge to the American standard, he was quite clear he judged to the UK standard and the bitch won because her movement was so outstanding compared to all the other bitches. She probably hadn't won in the past because no local judge was willing to stir up the vitriol that resulted. Sad really, a bitch with good movement is important to keep in the gene pool.

 

[seashel]

This subject breaks my heart.
It stems from a petition created (I believe) in one of the Scandinavian countries where imports of US 'type' shelties have been prevailing over the UK 'type'. Yes there is a difference between the two lines but it is mainly related to the head proportions rather than differences in the dogs as a whole. What I find so disappointing is that those who support 'a split' are so focussed on the differences that they cannot seem to see that there are so many more similarities. There are surely points to admire in both 'types'. It is like a case of national 'Kennel blindness' as far as I'm concerned. Yes by all means the UK show scene should aim for judges to reward dogs that adhere as closely as possible to the standard, but judging is of course subjective and one person's idea of perfection may be very far from another person's, even while both are correct. It just depends upon the emphasis that is placed on certain things. If it were hypothetically possible to 'split' the breed (and I do not see how this could be practically achieved in reality given the degree of blending which is going on in the rest of the world) it would still be entirely possible for UK breeders to breed, show and win with shelties which resembled those in the US as it is all down to selection of the puppies that are kept for showing. A breed develops in the way that breeders and judges steer it so you could just as easily retain the 'UK type' through blending the US/UK lines and selecting dogs that favoured the UK standard than by eliminating dogs from the gene pool with the US lines behind them. The breed is in far greater danger from a potential split, we NEED this gene pool to stay as open and large as possible. I've seen nothing to indicate that one country's dogs are any healthier than the other, that seems to be scaremongering to hype people up. The modern shelties in both countries bear almost no resemblance to the pictures of the original Shetland collie, which was basically a hotch potch of lots of breeds and it was only when it was identified as having show potential that the real creation of a distinct breed occurred. Shelties in 2016 are pretty different from the sheltie of the 70's and 80's (I'm going by pictures - I wasn't in the breed then!) so I don't subscribe to the claim of the 'true UK type' either.
Of course this is only my opinion and I do respect the dedication of all the sheltie breeders who have spent many many years (decades) devoted to the breed. I completely understand the intention of keeping true to the breed standard of the particular country but rewarding 'incorrect' dogs (however they deviate from the breed standard) in the show ring is an entirely different problem from being concerned about the genetic material which is being (re)introduced. The proposed solution is just not going to solve the perceived problem and it would almost certainly have unintended consequences. I don't believe a split will be sanctioned but for my part, I love the Shetland Sheepdog, wherever he hails from and nothing is going to ever change that.

 

[Justicemom]

Interestingly a fellow sheltie exhibitor posted a picture on FB a couple days after this story came out of a moderate correct blue merle sheltie and labeled the picture UK or US. 3/4 of the people anwsered UK. Several just stated correct sheltie or would do well either place.

Turns out the dog pictured is a littermate to the RWD from this years nationals.

 

[Selena Wohlslagel]

In fact, there are marked differences between US Shelties and UK Shelties...all you have to do is look at photos of the two side by side. The British variety is finer boned, with a narrower, more pointed muzzle. Do they still look like Shelties? Yes. It really becomes a matter or preference, and whether you believe the argument that the US lines carry more genetic problems.

There's a huge interest overseas in importing US Shelties, and numerous overseas breeders can be found at our National looking for dogs to buy. Unless we see a flood of European judges in our rings, I don't see that judging to our standard will be a problem here. The hue and cry seems to come from England, more than our side of the pond.

 

[Selena Wohlslagel]

Personally I think it's a bit petty to split hairs so to speak.we know Luke is pure sheltie but not show quality and we love our blue eyed boy

 

[Selena Wohlslagel]

Thank you Piper's mom