ETS Update

I can think of a reason taylormade may have stopped given what I know about that line. The reason would be something that could cause ets. Of course the other person with that line is still breeding them despite the proven issue.
 
So, Taylormade stopped breeding all dogs? They were all affected?
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I know that the breeder that owns Taylormade completely stopped breeding. Her dogs were in some of the original ETS videos that LM observed/published. Here's a quote from the LM video regarding this breeder, "After becoming aware of ETS, the owner/breeder of this dog spayed and neutered all of her related dogs in an effort to prevent recurrence, despite the potential for producing top performance prospects."

I can't say for sure if ALL of them were affected--but I think that enough of them were affected that continuing to breed wasn't a good idea.

HopeShelties said:
I can think of a reason taylormade may have stopped given what I know about that line. The reason would be something that could cause ets. Of course the other person with that line is still breeding them despite the proven issue.
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I think that Rebound is clear--though I am getting all this information second hand, so I can't swear by it.

Here are some of the original videos for more info:

http://www.cleanrun.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_id=603

I think the first sheltie is a Taylormade dog, and the second is Himark (Jeep)
 
OK, I see where on the Clean Run site they say that all dogs that were "related" to the ones that were thought to have ETS were spayed and neutered. That makes more sense than just not breeding any of the dogs.

That is how breeders should work with any of their animals to eliminate certain faults. You don't just stop breeding, you stop breeding the animals that produce those certain traits.
 
Ets

I absolutley know nada about breeding but isn't it possible that any breeder could produce pups with ETS? Anything is possible.
 
Sharon said:
I absolutley know nada about breeding but isn't it possible that any breeder could produce pups with ETS? Anything is possible.
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Sure. Just like a breeder could produce a pup out of the right size standard with shelties. Or a dog with an under/overbite. The breed people are not going to demand that this line be outcasted and have people recommend them to stop breeding because they have these throwbacks. There wouldn't be any lines if this was the case, as each line has produced some fault at one time or another. It is the breeders responsibility to identify where that fault came from and breed out that fault.

It is a different story when the line has something that is fatal or seriously hinders the dogs life....such as eplipsy, certain cancers, hip displasia, etc.

It is just that in agility there are some big names out there....that are always producing the top dogs in the country. So when a dog from that line has a problem the name is known :wink2: I don't have a ton of experience with this in regards to shelties, but I am very familiar with this in setters.
 
danisgoat said:
Sure. Just like a breeder could produce a pup out of the right size standard with shelties. Or a dog with an under/overbite. The breed people are not going to demand that this line be outcasted and have people recommend them to stop breeding because they have these throwbacks. There wouldn't be any lines if this was the case, as each line has produced some fault at one time or another. It is the breeders responsibility to identify where that fault came from and breed out that fault.

It is a different story when the line has something that is fatal or seriously hinders the dogs life....such as eplipsy, certain cancers, hip displasia, etc.

It is just that in agility there are some big names out there....that are always producing the top dogs in the country. So when a dog from that line has a problem the name is known :wink2: I don't have a ton of experience with this in regards to shelties, but I am very familiar with this in setters.
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Exactly. And the hard thing about ETS is that it's so hard to identify. Some dogs who jump "off" may have a kind of ETS (I think "classic ETS") that other than watching them jump--is clinically unidentifiable (because of the limitations of dog eye tests).

So you may be breeding dogs that are affected and have no idea because they aren't showing any symptoms (maybe you don't do agility with them).
 
Sharon said:
I absolutley know nada about breeding but isn't it possible that any breeder could produce pups with ETS? Anything is possible.
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Absolutely. But the older they are when you breed to them, the more certainty you can have that they are not themselves affected.

I wouldn't spay everything and stop breeding, but I would carefully evaluate, figure out the inheritance, and outcross to lines not known to have it. I don't think it's a horrible enough "disorder" (and I use that term lightly) to throw out a whole program based on.
 
Ets

ClantyreSheltie said:
Absolutely. But the older they are when you breed to them, the more certainty you can have that they are not themselves affected.

I wouldn't spay everything and stop breeding, but I would carefully evaluate, figure out the inheritance, and outcross to lines not known to have it. I don't think it's a horrible enough "disorder" (and I use that term lightly) to throw out a whole program based on.
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Thanks for the info.So you or anyone else tha breeds dog could produce it and never know.that stinks
 
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