My husband wants to get rid of our shelties!

This is going to give you a lifetime of heartache if you don't nip it.

I have the same issue and have decided on getting the help of a trainer. I know the theory, personally, and have bad sims success, but not complete. It usually only takes a few sessions.

But do interview the trainer as to his techniques to make sure you are comfortable with the style.
 
I learned this lesson the hard way...

I took my adopted sheltie Logan to a new training location where they had provided day care and grooming services. I assumed that they would have a first rate trainer there for the 8 week session.

I had taken my other 2 rescues to a local training program and LOVED IT! The dogs did very well and the trainers were very structured and certified.

Logan's class was terrible. The trainer had 6 dogs in the class that were totally uncontrollable. She allowed the dogs to continually jump on their owners! She just told them to ignore the behavior!

The previous classes I took had the trainer teaching the owners the OFF command. I felt as if Logan's trainers style did not fit what I was looking for. I left after the third class. Lost the money I paid.

So, BarbV's advice... But do interview the trainer as to his techniques to make sure you are comfortable with the style ... is correct!
 
corbinam said:
I wanted to mention that if I'm training one of my dogs the other two are barking and whining at the door/in their crates/inside. They aren't scared, they're brats! :lol:
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If you want to get this solved you do need to separate them. But I agree, they aren't scared, they're being brats. You need to give the dog you are not training something to do, otherwise they're just locked up and will carry on to get out. Give the one locked up a Kong or something else to chew on to keep them occupied. And start by only doing it for short times, just a couple of minutes and then build it up until they get used to it.

It sounds more and more like you could benefit from going to training. Learn to have your dogs focus on you, learn to communicate with them and be a leader. When I would take one dog to training (or for individual walks because I did this until Tully was a year old), I would leave a treasure hunt for the one staying at home. So instead of having dinner in a bowl I would hide chicken around the house for them to search for while we are out.

Honestly, you do need to deal with the problem now - they won't grow out of it.
 
Hanne said:
Yes, only if he can learn it, then your dogs also be able to, otherwise not :hide

(I'm really, really sorry you have these problems).
Click to expand...

I was talking about "aplying the method to my husband"....:wink2: but I'm not sure if "he can learn it" ....surely dogs will!

I feel under presure because of this, and I'm getting hard with my shelties to obey, they are so sensitive that they know something is wrong at home and my sheltie shoul is stiky to me more than never.

I have been looking for a behavourist near here, I have seen one and I want to talk to him about my problem. He has courses but not now, and it costs 385 for 8 hour in several classes (2 hours once a week)...if you add that they are two shelties....it's 770 €...I think I can't afford this now. So I'll be trying your methods by de moment.

Thanks to you for all your advices! It's nice feeling you're not alone when you have such a problem. :hugs
 
If you can't afford the training classes, you'll have to make your best effort at home.

First and foremost - YOU have to remain calm and in control. I know things are a bit tense around the house but, as you know, Shelties pick up on it.

Second - Educate yourself on positive reinforcement techniques for training. There are a LOT of resources on the Internet and YouTube. I recommend this site, https://positively.com/dog-training/ and specifically this page https://positively.com/dog-training/positive-training/. Positively is operated by Victoria Stilwell. She's a well respected dog trainer from the UK who specializes in positive reinforcement techniques.

For training, I personally LOVE Clicker Training. The click of the clicker replaces a verbal "Yes" to mark the correct behavior. It takes some time to get yourself properly synchronized to click/treat at the correct time but it's worth it. My dog learns a behavior 10x faster with the clicker than without it. If you can't find clickers or can't order them online, use a click pen with the button on top.

Third - Start SMALL! You aren't going to resolve the lunging and barking at everything that moves the first day out. It may take a few MONTHS to even get to a point where they are calmer and able to focus. The first thing they need to learn is impulse control.

In the basic agility class I occasionally teach, we have a game we play with the dogs called Cookie Zen. The purpose is to have the dog sit still in order to earn the treat. It basically works like this:
1 - Sit your dog in front of you. You should be at their level so sit or kneel on the floor with them.
2 - Put a high value treat in on hand and hold the hand out to the dog, fist closed but fingers up so you can open you hand and present the treat.
3 - Starting with the closed fist, sit still and wait until the dog stops pawing, nosing, etc. at your hand to get the treat. When they are still (not necessarily sitting but not going after your hand) click or say "yes" and give them the treat.
4 - Repeat step 3 until the dog has it nearly mastered.
5 - Similar to step 3 except your hand is open with the food in your palm. You will need fast reflexes to prevent the dog from getting the treat from your hand before they are calm.
6 - Repeat step 5 until nearly mastered
7 - Place the treat on the floor in front of the dog. Cover it with your hand if they go for it before you click or say "yes".

Another thing you need to work on while teaching impulse control is "Watch me".
1 - Hold a treat up to your forehead between your eyes. AS SOON as they make eye contact, click or say "yes" and give them the treat. You are NOT giving them a command yet. They don't know what "Watch me" means.
2 - Repeat step 1 until the dog is automatically making eye contact with you quickly.
3 - Repeat step 1 but add the command "Watch me"

Once they have some level of impulse control and understand Watch me, you can take them outside, ONE AT A TIME, and work on the movement. Take HIGH VALUE treats, something they will want to eat MORE than they are interested in the movement. Be as far away from where the bikers, runners, etc. are as possible so you are setting your dogs up for success.

BEFORE the dog sees the biker, runner, etc., meaning YOU have to be watching out for them and noticing them at a distance, get your dog to do a "Watch me" but this time HOLD THE TREAT RIGHT UNDER THEIR MUZZLE. Let them lick at it and nibble at it as the moving object passes. Reward with a click or "Yes" and the treat in your hand.

This is going to be MUCH HARDER than teaching "Watch me" or them learning the Cookie Zen game because they are already pattered to bark and lung at the bikers and runners. It can be done but it will take patience and, more importantly, time. As I said above, this is NOT an "overnight" fix. It can take months of training.

You need to be consistent and calm. If you are not calm, the Shelties will think there is something to fear and it will just heighten their reactions.

I hope some of this helps you.
 
Silaria said:
If you can't afford the training classes, you'll have to make your best effort at home.

First and foremost - YOU have to remain calm and in control. I know things are a bit tense around the house but, as you know, Shelties pick up on it.

Second - Educate yourself on positive reinforcement techniques for training. There are a LOT of resources on the Internet and YouTube. I recommend this site, https://positively.com/dog-training/ and specifically this page https://positively.com/dog-training/positive-training/. Positively is operated by Victoria Stilwell. She's a well respected dog trainer from the UK who specializes in positive reinforcement techniques.

For training, I personally LOVE Clicker Training. The click of the clicker replaces a verbal "Yes" to mark the correct behavior. It takes some time to get yourself properly synchronized to click/treat at the correct time but it's worth it. My dog learns a behavior 10x faster with the clicker than without it. If you can't find clickers or can't order them online, use a click pen with the button on top.

Third - Start SMALL! You aren't going to resolve the lunging and barking at everything that moves the first day out. It may take a few MONTHS to even get to a point where they are calmer and able to focus. The first thing they need to learn is impulse control.

In the basic agility class I occasionally teach, we have a game we play with the dogs called Cookie Zen. The purpose is to have the dog sit still in order to earn the treat. It basically works like this:
1 - Sit your dog in front of you. You should be at their level so sit or kneel on the floor with them.
2 - Put a high value treat in on hand and hold the hand out to the dog, fist closed but fingers up so you can open you hand and present the treat.
3 - Starting with the closed fist, sit still and wait until the dog stops pawing, nosing, etc. at your hand to get the treat. When they are still (not necessarily sitting but not going after your hand) click or say "yes" and give them the treat.
4 - Repeat step 3 until the dog has it nearly mastered.
5 - Similar to step 3 except your hand is open with the food in your palm. You will need fast reflexes to prevent the dog from getting the treat from your hand before they are calm.
6 - Repeat step 5 until nearly mastered
7 - Place the treat on the floor in front of the dog. Cover it with your hand if they go for it before you click or say "yes".

Another thing you need to work on while teaching impulse control is "Watch me".
1 - Hold a treat up to your forehead between your eyes. AS SOON as they make eye contact, click or say "yes" and give them the treat. You are NOT giving them a command yet. They don't know what "Watch me" means.
2 - Repeat step 1 until the dog is automatically making eye contact with you quickly.
3 - Repeat step 1 but add the command "Watch me"

Once they have some level of impulse control and understand Watch me, you can take them outside, ONE AT A TIME, and work on the movement. Take HIGH VALUE treats, something they will want to eat MORE than they are interested in the movement. Be as far away from where the bikers, runners, etc. are as possible so you are setting your dogs up for success.

BEFORE the dog sees the biker, runner, etc., meaning YOU have to be watching out for them and noticing them at a distance, get your dog to do a "Watch me" but this time HOLD THE TREAT RIGHT UNDER THEIR MUZZLE. Let them lick at it and nibble at it as the moving object passes. Reward with a click or "Yes" and the treat in your hand.

This is going to be MUCH HARDER than teaching "Watch me" or them learning the Cookie Zen game because they are already pattered to bark and lung at the bikers and runners. It can be done but it will take patience and, more importantly, time. As I said above, this is NOT an "overnight" fix. It can take months of training.

You need to be consistent and calm. If you are not calm, the Shelties will think there is something to fear and it will just heighten their reactions.

I hope some of this helps you.
Click to expand...

This is a great start, and everything that I remember from puppy school.

What Silaria for got to mention is why "watch me" is so important!

With every interaction with your pup their are various signals....hand, movement and eye contact.

I've found that eye contact has been one of the most powerful when dealing with training a dog. So "watch me" forces them to look me in the eye and get non verbal, signals, positive and negative.

But in order to get eye contact you have to teach them to look at you.....this is the purpose of Silaria's training technique. Just to clarify.

Once you teach them eye contact, you can control almost any behaviour.
 
Thank you I'll try everything you say.

I have been working on it since months ago, in fact it works quite well....but not always. The male is more focused on learning, but the female is more nervous and as she is the second in the leader scale she is harder to be trained. I will try the kong for being them separated and train better the female.

But the thing is that while they are leashed they obey better than when they aren't. The male works well on "look at me" but not all the times. I think what we need is time to practice more and more, they are still young (1 year) so they are starting to be mature now.

I also practice exercises to them learn to wait, for example when I go out for a walk with them I pass through the door first and ask them to wait into until I call them to go out. As they are very unquiet dogs I'm working on them to be patient...I think it could help too to control themselves.

But I think I'm far away from the day I could trust in walking them unleashed....not sure if that day will arrive...but I'm working hard on it.
 
alonsoe said:
But I think I'm far away from the day I could trust in walking them unleashed....not sure if that day will arrive...but I'm working hard on it.
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If they have a strong herding drive (that's why they are so intent on changing things that move) you may never be able to walk them off leash except in secure areas they can't escape from. Time will tell.

Good luck with your training. Read everything you can about how to use positive training techniques. TRY to convince your husband to, at the very least, use the same commands and rewards for behaviors you are. Consistency is really going to be key to helping them be successful.

One other thing I'd suggest is, if they are outside and start reacting over the top, correct them with a "No" and take them immediately inside. Once they settle down, take them outside again. Shelties are smart, they will start to connect the over the top behavior gets them taken back inside and should begin to settle.
 
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