Sandstorm- tipped ears (not) pet quality pup

On a different thread, we talked about how the breed is still relatively young. I think the standard is the correct standard, but it will take more time to breed it in. That is, open enough for hearing, but tipped enough to keep out the elements.

I'm not a breeder, but I defer to the breeders here....when you breed, do you look for proper "ear tipping" genetics, or do you rely on cosmetic fixes (e.g. gluing) to get around it.

The only other comment I will make is there are prick ears like Indy has, and then there are satellite ears. Clearly satellite ears are not on????

Here is an example of satellite ears, in my opinion!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shetland_Sheepdog

And here are Indy's ears...pricked, but not exaggerated!

http://www.sheltieforums.com/album.php?albumid=110&pictureid=1251

What do you all think?
 
Barb, if you are referring to the very-first photo on the Wikipedia page... those are "satellite" ears, for sure!

As to breeding for naturally-tipped ears... I wish I could say that we do. Unfortunately, if you wait around to see if the ears will set properly and tip naturally, you've waited way too long to fix any problems.

However, we DO select, in a way, for dogs with correct ear placement, size, and leather... Big Mickey-Mouse ears that are set far down the skull and made from thick, thick leather can be made to tip, but they'll still be big, have odd placement, and be prone to pricking because of the thickness of the leather. The ears may tip, but the expression will still not be quite what we're looking for. Does any of this make sense?
 
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tofu pup said:
Barb, if you are referring to the very-first photo on the Wikipedia page... I recognize that dog. His owner has been showing him off and on around New England, telling everyone who will listen that he's a remarkable example of the "old-fashioned" Sheltie and that she intends to breed many more from him.

And yes, those are "satellite" ears, for sure!

As to breeding for naturally-tipped ears... I wish I could say that we do. Unfortunately, if you wait around to see if the ears will set properly and tip naturally, you've waited way too long to fix any problems.

However, we DO select, in a way, for dogs with correct ear placement, size, and leather... Big Mickey-Mouse ears that are set far down the skull and made from thick, thick leather can be made to tip, but they'll still be big, have odd placement, and be prone to pricking because of the thickness of the leather. The ears may tip, but the expression will still not be quite what we're looking for. Does any of this make sense?
Click to expand...

Yes, that was definitely what I was getting at!

It's one thing to decide to tip or not to tip. But's it's the Mickey Mouse ears that I object to! I look at Indy's ears which are mostly pricked, but they are small in size and don't take over his face! So I can live with it.

So maybe the issue is not the tip of the ear (which can be corrected) but the size of the ear itself. As you say, the placement, the texture of the leather, etc.

I personally don't find the huge ears attractive on a Sheltie at all. And I'm going to really stretch my point here, but saying that those great big ears make them look like mutts!

Ok - having launched the bullet, I'm ready to take the heat as the forum weighs in. But please, let's not get nasty or personal though. We're talking about standards, here. Not our own pups (Heck, I've got a hound dog in my house!)
 
BarbV said:
On a different thread, we talked about how the breed is still relatively young. I think the standard is the correct standard, but it will take more time to breed it in. That is, open enough for hearing, but tipped enough to keep out the elements.

I'm not a breeder, but I defer to the breeders here....when you breed, do you look for proper "ear tipping" genetics, or do you rely on cosmetic fixes (e.g. gluing) to get around it.

The only other comment I will make is there are prick ears like Indy has, and then there are satellite ears. Clearly satellite ears are not on????

Here is an example of satellite ears, in my opinion!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shetland_Sheepdog

And here are Indy's ears...pricked, but not exaggerated!

http://www.sheltieforums.com/album.php?albumid=110&pictureid=1251

What do you all think?
Click to expand...

I'm with you Barb. Meggie's ears are prick ears, but they are a nice size for her head, much like Indy's. I just couldn't bring myself to doing the whole gluing thing. I tried, but she seemed uncomfortable with the changing of the glue, etc. Since she's a "pet quality" dog I saw no need to torture her. As far as being cute, goodness she couldn't be any cuter in my eyes!

My grand-dogger, Piper, has naturally tipped, perfect ears. She is also a "pet quality dog" and my daughter didn't bother with her ears. They just tipped all on their own. But her sister, Lily had to have hers glued. Nikki didn't get Lily until she was three, so she didn't have to deal with the gluing.

I say they should show as the grow! But that's just me.
 
MissSuzie said:
I'm with you Barb. Meggie's ears are prick ears, but they are a nice size for her head, much like Indy's. I just couldn't bring myself to doing the whole gluing thing. I tried, but she seemed uncomfortable with the changing of the glue, etc. Since she's a "pet quality" dog I saw no need to torture her. As far as being cute, goodness she couldn't be any cuter in my eyes!

My grand-dogger, Piper, has naturally tipped, perfect ears. She is also a "pet quality dog" and my daughter didn't bother with her ears. They just tipped all on their own. But her sister, Lily had to have hers glued. Nikki didn't get Lily until she was three, so she didn't have to deal with the gluing.

I say they should show as the grow! But that's just me.
Click to expand...

I'm not against the show as they grow idea personally.. except that I prefer the tipped ear look. Don't get me wrong, if Deja's ears don't end up taking, I'm not going to think she is any less awesomely cute.
 
Barb: Gus' ears are like Indy's, too High on the head, but a size that doesn't scream "Corgi." I love Corgis, by the way.

This thread is so timely, folks. Gus' ears were glued when I got him (at 10 weeks) and they stayed that way for maybe another month. I decided not to pursue gluing and his ears went prick. But...I swear they are now starting to tip slightly. Can that be? At a year old?
 
re- BarbV, and Indys ears!

BarbV said:
On a different thread, we talked about how the breed is still relatively young. I think the standard is the correct standard, but it will take more time to breed it in. That is, open enough for hearing, but tipped enough to keep out the elements.

I'm not a breeder, but I defer to the breeders here....when you breed, do you look for proper "ear tipping" genetics, or do you rely on cosmetic fixes (e.g. gluing) to get around it.

The only other comment I will make is there are prick ears like Indy has, and then there are satellite ears. Clearly satellite ears are not on????

Here is an example of satellite ears, in my opinion!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shetland_Sheepdog

And here are Indy's ears...pricked, but not exaggerated!

http://www.sheltieforums.com/album.php?albumid=110&pictureid=1251

What do you all think?
Click to expand...

I think Indy is gorgeous- his ears are like Sandstorms. I also think it is important to breed to or close to the standard- I have learned that so many Shelties look so different from each other, and over-all size of the dog also varies so much!
Karen
 
RetiredProf said:
Barb: Gus' ears are like Indy's, too High on the head, but a size that doesn't scream "Corgi." I love Corgis, by the way.

This thread is so timely, folks. Gus' ears were glued when I got him (at 10 weeks) and they stayed that way for maybe another month. I decided not to pursue gluing and his ears went prick. But...I swear they are now starting to tip slightly. Can that be? At a year old?
Click to expand...

That's my point exactly. The decision to glue or not to glue is one question. But when we are breeding Sheltie's with huge ears, I do have a problem. That definitely detracts from the overall look of the breed, in my view. And perpetuates difficulty in getting the ears to the state we ultimately we want them to be in thought ongoing breding.
 
Cleveland's ears were satellite ears. I got use to them, but was also very aware of them. I think his ears were one of the main reasons he got......"awww a miniature collie"...... so often.

McKinley's are tipped and haven't been taped in the past 2 months and I don't want them to prick. Connie, Megan.....should he be re-taped? I took the last setting out the end of December.

I think that the soft tipped ears are the signature for the sheltie breed. Thank you Dr Shelli for giving reason to the tipping.
 
RonandJan said:
Cleveland's ears were satellite ears. I got use to them, but was also very aware of them. I think his ears were one of the main reasons he got......"awww a miniature collie"...... so often.

McKinley's are tipped and haven't been taped in the past 2 months and I don't want them to prick. Connie, Megan.....should he be re-taped? I took the last setting out the end of December.

I think that the soft tipped ears are the signature for the sheltie breed. Thank you Dr Shelli for giving reason to the tipping.
Click to expand...

How old is McKinley now? I think he may be beyond the time that it could have any significant effect, but if they are tipped now, there is still a chance they will stay that way.
 
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