At the End of My Leash

[celloyogi]

or try another trainer, a can of pennies is usually not working in my experience.
it just increases a dog's frustration

I second that. Or at least work with the trainer to not use something like the can of pennies idea. You'll have a few problems I can see right off the bat, the first being that you said your pup loves noise. The point of the can is that the noise will stop many dogs right in their tracks (fear or startle). If your dog likes the noise, the can isn't go to help you. This leads to the second problem. Using the can, or really using anything that will increase his reactiveness (noise, physical forms of correction, spray bottles or ice water from a passing car, etc) will in all likelihood make your pup more reactive. He'll learn to anticipate the noise and start to react to that and whatever it was you were trying to prevent in the first place.

You said your pup was on his best behavior while working with the trainer, and because you were in unfamiliar territory. Can you change the location of your walks? Or try to vary the route as much as possible? This helped with my Olive, along with some other techniques I've put in other posts. Since we started back out on the sidewalks, which makes up maybe 20% or less of total walk time (any more and out comes her crazies), we do a lot of heelwork and misc "stuff" on the sidewalk. I keep throwing stuff at her so there is very little chance for her to take her eyes off me. If we're not heeling, we're sit/down/drop/stay/etc. I know it's time to quit when she starts to veer away or I can't get her eyes back on me. Try taking a basic obedience class and practicing on the sidewalk in short bursts to keep your pup's attention on you.

Seven months is still a puppy. It's tough to hear but patience is going to be your best ally.

 

[Psalms]

I would love to take him to obedience class, but I have hesitated because of his car sickness. Nothing seems to help. I know it has been suggested that I put him in the car anyway and tough it out. But oh, you have no idea how hard it is to force a terrified, trembling, whimpering puppy into what he views as a torture chamber. I did drive him to the trainer, but that was a one-time deal. Most classes are once a week for 6 weeks. He is so smart that he knows when I'm going to try to put him in the car even if I don't say the word, even if I put on the same outdoor clothes that I wear on our walks. He starts to cower and shake and cry, and I feel like Lucretia Borgia (or whatever her name was).

I had a dream last night in which I was talking to a kindly old gentleman who was a bit of a dog guru (remember...this was a dream). He looked at me sadly and said, "Some dogs will always lunge at cars; it can't be trained out of them." I woke up depressed. Janet

 

[Lahree]

I think the biggest issue for now is your baby's age. He is still a puppy and is going to act the age he is. With gentle, consistent, training and I'll bet he "gets" it.

I had EXACTLY the same frustration you had and I have a very, very, very smart Sheltie. All I wanted to do was go on a peaceful walk. I have to be honest and say it took a long, long, long time to get it right. One day, Ellie just started behaving. It was like a light bulb came on and she started to act 1,000 times better than she ever had. This was after three classes, a trainer, a bazillion hours of our own training, hours of advice on this forum (LOL) and tears and frustration gallore.

Ellie has never reacted at all to motorized wheelchairs, skateboards, skooter, motorcycles or bicycles. However, cars, yeah, she would lunge. We taught her to sit when we saw a car coming. If she sat and looked at us, she got a treat. It didnt take long before Ellie saw a car and sat before we said anything. She wanted the treat! LOL! Like I said, smart dog. She got to the point where we'd be walkig along and she would just sit. I would turn to look to see why and there would be a car coming that I didn't hear. Ya gotta love her.

She reacts to some dogs on a walk--not all. Some she doesn't look twice at, some she barks and tugs at the leash. For some reason it took me forever to get it in my brain what numerous people have told me. Not all dogs like each other.

Me, personally, would skip using any noise maker. At your pup's age, I think everything on the walk should be fun, fun, fun WITH structure. If he pulls, oops, we are going the other way....pulls that way...oops, we are going the other way, etc.

I hope that you can get to the dream. Sometimes, when we have challenging baby's like yours, you are just going to have to stay with it for the long haul and just expect the frustrations. It is SOOOOOOOOO worth it in the end!

 

[SheepOfBlue]

I would love to take him to obedience class, but I have hesitated because of his car sickness. Nothing seems to help. I know it has been suggested that I put him in the car anyway and tough it out. But oh, you have no idea how hard it is to force a terrified, trembling, whimpering puppy into what he views as a torture chamber. I did drive him to the trainer, but that was a one-time deal. Most classes are once a week for 6 weeks. He is so smart that he knows when I'm going to try to put him in the car even if I don't say the word, even if I put on the same outdoor clothes that I wear on our walks. He starts to cower and shake and cry, and I feel like Lucretia Borgia (or whatever her name was).

I had a dream last night in which I was talking to a kindly old gentleman who was a bit of a dog guru (remember...this was a dream). He looked at me sadly and said, "Some dogs will always lunge at cars; it can't be trained out of them." I woke up depressed. Janet

On the car try putting him in, praising him. Then let him out with no trip and feed him. Do that until the tension lessons then start the car but don't go anywhere then.... You get the idea.

 

[Toffee's Mom]

On the car try putting him in, praising him. Then let him out with no trip and feed him. Do that until the tension lessons then start the car but don't go anywhere then.... You get the idea.

That and patience.. don't be so anxious yourself, if you can help it, relax going into a car.. dogs feel our anxieties...
and my best tip was Cerennia from the Vet!... got me and Toffee over that!!
It doesn't make them drowsy, just doesn't make them puke. Worked great a couple of times, and never needed it since. Toffee was also VERY carsick.

 

[celloyogi]

On the car try putting him in, praising him. Then let him out with no trip and feed him. Do that until the tension lessons then start the car but don't go anywhere then.... You get the idea.

Definitely. If the only times he goes in the car are to get to what he considers unpleasant destinations, it only makes sense that he'll hate the car. Try SheepOfBlue suggestion, and once your pup is comfortable with getting in the car, take short trips (even just around the block, or up and down the driveway) and back. Get out of the car, treat, play. Trips with a fun destination - Olive loves the frou-frou pet store where she can self-serve from the treat bin! - might help.

To a large extent issues like the car are issues that must be worked on, not avoided. The trick is to confront things slowly and incrementally. You want to be able to take your dog on a drive, so you need to get him comfortable with that. Same for taking walks. It may take weeks or months to build up to anything substantial but it will be worth it, I promise!

And the old dude dog guru in your dream was completely, totally wrong. Dogs can be trained not to lunge at cars; it just takes times, patience, and the right method (which is not going to be the same for every dog).

 

[corbinam]

I agree. I would spend a lot of time working on making him feel comfortable in the car. Just go out there, have him hop in, give a cookie/praise and hop out.

I have a reactive dog that barks and lunges at dogs and people on walks. I don't mean to discourage you, but he is 5 and we have not figured out a way to fix it. If we run into no one, he is the absolute best dog you will ever walk. But if we walk past a dog, he's a nightmare and nothing I've done has helped. I just pick him up and quickly walk away.

I think the key is being able to work on it when the dog is under their threshold, and that can be hard to do if there are a lot of triggers where you walk.

 

[Caro]

I agree, ditch the can of coins - just gives them something else to bark at. Change it for squeaky ball - much better for distracting a dog and getting them to focus on you.

This is a really common problem in herding dogs. Have a look at this thread from last month http://www.sheltieforums.com/showthread.php?t=16791 - same problem and similar age. There are lots of ideas that should help.

If you still have the head collar I would use it. No dog takes to a head collar - you have to accustom them to the feel before using it on a walk, it should take about a week. Start by putting it on when he is eating for the first couple of days. Then let him wear it around the house for a couple of days (when you are there). After he has gotten used to that put it on him for walks, but don't use it, so he gets used to it being on while you are walking. After a couple of days of this you can start using the head halter.

 

[Psalms]

Thanks for the head halter tip, Caro. Yup, I ditched the can. Janet

 

[Toffee's Mom]

Thanks for the head halter tip, Caro. Yup, I ditched the can. Janet

nice
things will work out, I promise... I used to think I could never do stuff with Toffee his car lunging was bad, his going after other dogs was scary...
It isn't anymore!!! Almost everything can be managed that can't be trained, and you obviously are so committed and awesome, just be good to yourself and breathe... In 6 months or sooner you will be posting here and sharing some of your tips that you got or discovered yourself on your journey to training with your pup!