Differing hand signals and starting from level 1 (at a new training center)

[Greenepony]

I guess this has two parts:



Today, DH, Olive and I went to a pet festival in our area and I asked a local training center if they required everyone to go through the levels or if they did evaluations to find best fit (what I’m used to in the horse world, my first lesson with a new trainer is an evaluation of everything I know to see what I should be doing- not stick me on a lead line and tell me my left foot goes in the left stirrup). They said they make everyone go level 1 (sit, stay, etc) and then on to 2 (final CGC prep, which is what I was interested in) because they wanted everyone to learn “their system”. Is this normal? I’d assuming working one on one a trainer would want to move to the level the dog is at.


Also, later DH suggested they were similar to another trainer we ran into last year who dismissed Olive as knowing nothing because she didn’t know to sit when the lady touched her (the lady’s) clavicle, that they have their own cues and if the dog doesn’t know them by that way then it needs to start from the beginning. I understand with sporting there are certain cues that are standardized to be most effective but for regular house-pet obedience are there standardized cues that I just missed? Is it normal to expect the dog to start over from scratch if it’s been taught another method?
(for the record, Olive went into a beautiful sit at the word ‘sit’ even without a hand signal, the lady just expected her to respond the throat tap- which DH thinks was more of a Klingon salute than a throat tap)

 

[SheltieChe]

short answer yes
There are many ways to teach obedience, and dog training in general.
Lots of different methodologies, some will blame the dog- dog is ¨stubborn¨, some will use punishment, some will use clicker, some will use learning theory some will know nothing about it.
For pet owner knowing hand signals is not a must for CGC test.

 

[labgirl]

Most clubs like you to start at level 1, so they can assess you and your dog. Often you get moved on quite quickly.

As for hand signals - I use whatever works for me, if the trainer doesn't like them I would go to another trainer who didn't think the world revolved around them! I consider signals a personal thing between you and the dog, they have to be something you are comfortable with, else you will forget them. Yes there are certain handling quirks to be avoided, and a good trainer will explain why, but just changing your signal because it isn't their signal isn't a good reason.

 

[Greenepony]

Most clubs like you to start at level 1, so they can assess you and your dog. Often you get moved on quite quickly.

As for hand signals - I use whatever works for me, if the trainer doesn't like them I would go to another trainer who didn't think the world revolved around them! I consider signals a personal thing between you and the dog, they have to be something you are comfortable with, else you will forget them. Yes there are certain handling quirks to be avoided, and a good trainer will explain why, but just changing your signal because it isn't their signal isn't a good reason.

It's the move on quickly thing that I don't think was on their mind- the impression I got was that they expected everyone to go through the 7 week class no matter what. Oh well. It just didn't make sense to me coming from a different background with more independent instruction.

And Olive does know hand signals- but I've seen plenty of other dog owners use the same ones so I can't be that weird. (and frankly, I thought her 'sit' sign made zero sense, Olive was even giving her the you're-really-weird look)

 

[Toffee's Mom]

that seems so weird to me
Yes, I understand you may wanna start out new, etc etc...
but I am totally with labgirl on that one.
and snort at the klingon salut... I'd give it a wide berth

 

[Caro]

This is a constant battle at my club - whether to let a new member move up. Basically the 'old time' obedience triallers who think people should 'learn our methods' vs the rest of us who think it's about training companion dogs, not triallers. We have 1 trainer who the old time triallers have deemed okay to assess people to move up, and if she's not around then too bad. It's a darn nuisance though when you've got someone in your class that clearly shouldn't be there - puts the rest of the class off when their dog looks so far behind, then it's a pain to negotiate with another trainer to take the person into their class after classes have started, esp in the first couple of weeks when things are so busy.

And I would not change hand signals unless someone is teaching you a clearly superior hand signal. Signals are so important in communicating - dogs look for them far more verbal cues. So you're being asked to teach your dog a new language, after he's already learnt yours - confusing. Frankly I think it's just a bit arrogant for a trainer to assume you aren't communicating with your dog properly and their 'language' is better than yours. Admittedly sometimes someone will show you a better hand signal but it's up to you to decide whether you want to change.

 

[Internette]

I can relate for sure. Some people did a stop sign hand up for stop and some did a palm parallel to the floor and I asked which it was and was told it did not matter. I took the classes to prevent me confusing a very smart dog, I left more confused then when I started.
They were teaching 'stand" after doing a lie down command. When Chauncey came out of a lie down he would do a sit and not stand. I struggled with the stand on all fours. Chauncey does have a lazy couch potato laid back approach to life. Most dogs don't have a "hey Mom wanna sit on the bench instead of keep walking attitude" like Chauncey does. Our groomer said that shouldn't even be brought up in a CGC class as it is only taught to puppies for show ring so it doesn't muss their fur and for the table and isn't in the CGC list of must do. Chauncey just thought hey I am sitting, why do I have to stand when I can sit. lol.
I was also taken aside by the head teacher , boss of the group, She told me she would teach me a "trick" so Chauncey can rest his head on my knee or foot " look" obedient when we were out and I would know if he wondered off. Chauncey loves his outings and behaves beautifully he doesn't have to look obedient he is very obedient. Chauncey's head doesn't reach my knee when sitting He doesn't wonder off, he lies next to my legs and he is on a leash always. If he is on a leash how can he wonder off? I never understood when it isn't on a test and needed, it was someones idea of cute and not something for our class and was a waste of my time.
Some weeks there were 4 people running the class and 2 were students and they both did not finish the class and take the test with their dogs.
I am sure there will be some place more professional and more organized and suited for us somewhere out there with classes. Don't give up, we haven't yet. ( I am waiting for rainy season to be over and cooler temps before I start another class.)