Ellie's Fifth Rally Class--I AM SO MAD!!! (Long post)

Everything else aside just the fact that the instructor did not remove a mean dog from the group already is reason enough to leave.

At flyball Sca is convinced EVERYONE loves him (well pretty much everywhere :rolleyes2:) Some dogs are 'less' fond of him but zero dogs are allowed to be mean. I know there is one that was encouraged to take some time out. And that with an owner that has dogs on the team and really does watch her dog closely. However the dog didn't like Sca then later was getting after Sca's JR pal Tune, next few classes that dog was not there.

To bad you aren't closer though as Sca is the ultimate softy. He had a BC that is a bit 'off' and didn't like him. I actually thought it was two dogs since sometimes she likes him and other times not. Well he just wanders over to see which version is there. If the BC is having a bad night (she has NEVER been allowed to attack him or would not be allowed) then Sca wanders to find another buddy, if she is OK that night though he wants to play. So I am sure he would be relaxing for Ellie.

Oh, how I wish you did live nearby. Ellie adores and seeks out other Shelties. They "get" her.
 
I completely agree...
Ellie did everything right! Just don't chance going there again if that so called instructor is not moving that Rottie either to private consultation OR to another class. It's either the Rottie or Ellie, you tell her :D

Yes, I don't want to set-up Ellie for extremem diress or the dog possibility that the next time the Rott will get completely away from the owner. The dog is too much for her to handle. It is a wacked out dog. You can just tell by its mannerisims.
 
What an awful experience, as said above, my instructor would have kicked that Rott out of the class. No way would she allow behaviour like that!

I feel so sorry for Ellie, but she handled it well AND I think you did good to have a go at that girl and her Rottie. By doing that instead of maybe fussing or coaxing Ellie you showed you were in charge and were going to protect her. That meant she didn't feel the need to get aggressive because you were dealing with it. And that is really the best way to handle these things and long-term it will benefit Ellie because she feels she can trust you to sort stuff out.

Unfortunately there are lots of irresponsible owners out there, and we can't change that but we can mitigate the damage to our own dogs. Well done both of you for handling an awful situation really well and good luck finding a better class.

Thank you so much! She has learned to trust me completely now and that's one of the reasons that I think she is doing so well.
 
OMG
I AM SO MAD for you

However, first things first WHAT A GOOD GIRL, ELLIE!!!!.. I can't hardly believe it! All of that and she does well, and then even only freezes when goshdarn Rottie is about to snap her head off (and yours)

By the way I think I would write that instructor a very long complaint email, including what you said to that Rottie owner, for which I am very proud of for you, I hope she got THAT clear message!
You don't PAY to have that happen at HER class, the instructor is somewhat responsible to keep a SAFE environment for all concerned. She better put those Rott's in another class or give them their money back! Seriously!

Tell the instructor that if she can't keep a modicum of saftety for Ellie AND you, she needs to step up, and get rid of the offending dog, if she can't keep Ellie reasonably safe. Her being off gallivanting to have photos taken is NOT what she should have done on your dime. If she CANNOT promise you to deal with this, then she owes you money back and an apology!

Do find another place for training if she can't deliver!!!

Thank you! You are such a good cheerleader for me! You get me all psyched up and make me feel like Super Woman!

This was the first time that the instructor actually told the student to control her dog, correct her dog and to keep the dog away from Ellie. The fifth class was too little too late since this dog has lunged at Ellie every single class--sometimes more than once.

I don't even know if the instructor saw the third lunge where the dog came so close to my face and Ellie's head. I was so mad at the Rott and the owner that after I "talked" to her, I stormed out.
 
I'd be looking for somewhere else to train if that is the type of behavior they find acceptable.
Around here, you generally have to fill out a questionnaire asking about previous training experience, and if your dog is aggressive toward other dogs or people. Aggressive dogs, if known about aren't allowed into the class. If one slips through, it is kicked out of class permanently. Dangerous dogs aren't allowed to stay and cause further problems.
I used to see similar behavior to what you experienced with the instructor wandering off in the horse world with riding instructors. It always has made me angry to see someone being paid to do a job, and then choosing not to hold up their end of the deal. That's being a poor instructor. Another grounds for finding a new place to train.
 
How rude. If she can't manage her class then she shouldnt be running a class. Aside from the fact that its unprofessional to be so distracted when she has a class of people to teach, its irresponsible to leave dogs unsupervised when there have already been problems in the class. Honestly I would walk out too.
 
I think you are right some dogs do have this "victim" tattoo on their foreheads.
Kudos for you and Ellie to stand up! Things to remember that Ellie did well in this situation. If you can manage to keep your cool and discuss strategies with instructor I see no reason why you should not go back. There will be stupid/ rude dogs with stupid owners everywhere you go. But of course, you know better your situation. I am proud Ellie handled herself so well!
this is one of the great articles, I believe SC allows paper prints if given away for free, maybe your instructor as well as Rotti owner would like one
http://flyingdogpress.com/content/view/42/97/

Thank you. :smile2: It is true that there are stupid dog owners and stupid dogs everywhere, but there is only one class left and that is going to be a practice show. No instruction. There is just no reason for me to go back to this particular class, but I will email the instructor.
 
....

I don't even know if the instructor saw the third lunge where the dog came so close to my face and Ellie's head. I was so mad at the Rott and the owner that after I "talked" to her, I stormed out.

A good door slamming makes for a great exit as well :biggrin2:
I would definitely write something tho, that instructor needs to know, even if you guys don't go back there, the word gets around.
Mine wouldn't put up with that crap, let me tell you. Neither would I, and neither will you! :yes:
But before you decide not to go back, let the instructor know what happened, call or write, please. If nothing else you're going to make it better for somebody else, even if you're not going back, or if she continues to be clueless.
 
OMG

First, the photos. How rude! Really, do that on your own time when someone is not paying you for instruction during a class. That is so unprofessional.:mad:

Second, if that would have been my instructor she would have chucked that Rott right out of class. These are the things that happen when you are unprofessional and don't have control of your class. The first time it happen my instructor would have had a very frank discussion with the owner. The second they are gone. There would never be a third time. She would do privates but never endanger other dogs in class. She has BC as her breed but her husband is a retire K9 officer and they had had a Rott, a couple GSD and a couple Mals so does know the big guarding breeds and has little tolerance for owner denial. A couple months ago,she kicked out a huge Mastiff who was a distaster waiting to happen. The dog bit the husband and tried to bite another dog in class and her(the instructor) on the hand as he passed by. She told them the dog was dangerous. They were p**sed and in total denial. A week later, at home the wife was sitting behind the dog petting it long the back and he suddenly swung around and mauled her throat. She was lucky she didn't die. Warning signs everywhere, no one listened.

I think the freeze behavior was Ellie on high alert. Waiting for the next assult kind of thing. I have no doubt that if she was pushed she would have defended herself with a bite. I have seen dogs in the vet clinic do this. It means back off or I will bite you. When A dog freezes and stiffens and you don't have good control of it you are in trouble. At that point, I slowly disengage and move slowly out of the way. The bite is a hair trigger away and anything can set it off. Once the danger passed Ellie retrned to normal.

I would demand my money back and never return. I hope you can find another class for you and Ellie. I went to 4 different schools before I found the one I go to now. At one of them, I really did not feel safe. Too many out of control dogs. I was on pin and needles the whole time. One night Justice almost got bitten by a GSD and the instructor didn't seem to concerned. The next week another GSD went for another dog again no real concern. The next week more lunging/growling behavior. Finally one week, the first GSD attacked another dog on a sit stay, the second GSD joined in the fight, the rest of the dogs scattered. Justice was only 1 dog away when this went down. I never returned. My dogs safety is too important. The school I go to now I have witnessed less aggression in 8 yrs then I did in 6 weeks at the other place. Comes down to instructor control and commitment to providing a safe environment.

Thanks for your support. I hope I can find another class also. Ellie's bootcamp trainer recommended what she thinks is an awesome trainer that is about 45 minute drive each way from us. Although that is a long way, I might go watch a class and see how she handles the dogs and students and make a decision. This woman owns, breeds and shows BC's obedience champions. She does group or individual lessons.

There is also a instructor about 4 miles from us but her credentials look quite limited. She trains at a boarding facility. I might pay her classes a visit as well.

I am still looking.............
 
I'd be looking for somewhere else to train if that is the type of behavior they find acceptable.
Around here, you generally have to fill out a questionnaire asking about previous training experience, and if your dog is aggressive toward other dogs or people. Aggressive dogs, if known about aren't allowed into the class. If one slips through, it is kicked out of class permanently. Dangerous dogs aren't allowed to stay and cause further problems.
I used to see similar behavior to what you experienced with the instructor wandering off in the horse world with riding instructors. It always has made me angry to see someone being paid to do a job, and then choosing not to hold up their end of the deal. That's being a poor instructor. Another grounds for finding a new place to train.

We had to fill out a questionnaire on what previous training our dog had and where, but nowhere did it ask if our dog had any problems with other dogs. I was so impressed that in big letters that it said on the form (and on the web page) that there must be three feet of personal space all around your dog at all times and that you must control your dog. Hmmm. What happened to that? This instructor also lets one of her students (I think it's her life partner) yell over the top of her, take over, give instructions that contradict her own, ect. She doesn't even have control of her students!
 
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