evaluating newborns

I hosted some photos here:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/clantyre_rachael/sets/72157631329682200/

because I can't be bothered with that whole resizing thing to post them here.

OK. This is the evil dog from rat to now. She never went "off". Her head is what it was, there never was a "weird" stage. I tried to get pictures that show the same angle. My mentor says we want heads that look like dinosaurs at birth. I still have no idea what that means :smile2:

For reference, the two bitches in the one picture are Evie and her littermate. Evie 14 3/4 inches tall, her littermate is 13", on her tippy toes. Savvy makes Evie look like a moose.
 
I am assuming that you breeder is talking about the "bump" on the muzzle being pronounced at birth. In westies we want almost no bump as we want a muzzle that is slightly shorter than the skull. A good westie head at birth, when looked at dead on, will look like a smaller square stuck on a larger one. We want a strong, wide, underjaw - the better to grab and hang onto prey. At birth the extra length is smushed up toward the head so in a Belgian we want a big bump at birth seen in profile and an appearance of thickness of muzzle went looked at dead on but not the squareness as seen in the westie. I would hazard a guess that this is the "dinosaur" look that your breeder prefers in her newborns.
 
ClantyreSheltie said:
I hosted some photos here:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/clantyre_rachael/sets/72157631329682200/

because I can't be bothered with that whole resizing thing to post them here.

OK. This is the evil dog from rat to now. She never went "off". Her head is what it was, there never was a "weird" stage. I tried to get pictures that show the same angle. My mentor says we want heads that look like dinosaurs at birth. I still have no idea what that means :smile2:

For reference, the two bitches in the one picture are Evie and her littermate. Evie 14 3/4 inches tall, her littermate is 13", on her tippy toes. Savvy makes Evie look like a moose.
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Thanks for the pictures, she is beautiful!!

I am more of a visual person, no matter howm much I read I need those pictures so I can understand. Those helped a lot, plus who doesnt like to look at a sheltie :wink2: :biggrin2:
 
It's always puzzled me how anyone can see the potential of a sheltie puppy that young. The first three weeks, they look more like piglets than dogs! (and that goes for ALL dogs with me). My dad bred spaniels when I was growing up, so I've seen my share of puppies. You just can never tell until they grow out of the "drunken sailor" age.

So it's very intriguing to me, since the only Sheltie puppies I've seen are in pictures or my own Neechee, who was NOT show-quality, but had some definite traits that made him a huge success in the obedience ring. (He was very undersized, but had such a determined attitude and the desire to please.)

Looking at Evvie's photos was a good example, and if I fllip back and forth, I can see how she developed. But what I can't see is the little snubby newborn muzzle developing into that beautiful wedge-shaped head we all love.
 
latinsheltie said:
Hi everyone, what do you mean with "Blocky" heads?
Click to expand...

You want the baby's head to look sort of like a shoebox... with corners and straight lines and parallel planes from each side. Whatever you see at birth will become elongated and narrower. So, if you want to end with an adult dog that has a blunt-wedge head with "corners", you want to start with a baby that has a "fat", "blocky" little head. If you start with a newborn who has a tapering muzzle, it's going to elongate and narrow and become snipey.

Looking at puppies is a skill more than anything, and like any skill, you improve with practice. You look at a lot of puppies, and then you look at some more, and then you keep looking. There is always something to learn, and there is always room to improve.
 
tofu pup said:
Looking at puppies is a skill more than anything, and like any skill, you improve with practice. You look at a lot of puppies, and then you look at some more, and then you keep looking. There is always something to learn, and there is always room to improve.
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That is definitly the truth!! I am still looking at pictures of puppies on different breeders sites, plus always reading the standard over and over.
 
tofu pup said:
You want the baby's head to look sort of like a shoebox... with corners and straight lines and parallel planes from each side. Whatever you see at birth will become elongated and narrower. So, if you want to end with an adult dog that has a blunt-wedge head with "corners", you want to start with a baby that has a "fat", "blocky" little head. If you start with a newborn who has a tapering muzzle, it's going to elongate and narrow and become snipey.

Looking at puppies is a skill more than anything, and like any skill, you improve with practice. You look at a lot of puppies, and then you look at some more, and then you keep looking. There is always something to learn, and there is always room to improve.
Click to expand...

Thank you so much! My sheltie just had a litter of puppies and I'm deciding which one to keep
 
I got a call from a breeder she has pups and they weren't inexpensive but they are 24 days old and I was expected if I want a pup to pick one and put a deposit on it. Well the picks look like guinea pigs and I just dont see a sheltie. I think for the high price and picking an animal you will spend hopefully 15 plus years with, well I can't see the dog in the pup. I know I probably didn't make her happy but I kept telling her I can't see a sheltie or what it will look like and I don't mean to offend but that newborn puppiness doesn't thrill me like the pics of shelties thrill me. It is like a lottery pick in some ways. Maybe the 8 week stage would be better but I was told all puppies are picked at this young stage and promised out so young. I know whatever pup I will get will be something I will love but I don't want that well I wanted a white collar, I wanted a blaze , I wanted a lighter color stuff running through my head. I just don't know how to do this whole puppy thing successfully?
I did try for many months the whole adult thing and I won't go into it but I lost a lot of respect from some sheltie people and I have finally had enough tears and carrot dangling and false promises to last me a good long time. I refuse to be conned, hurt and mislead (intentionally or unintentionally I don't know)I spent the last 5 months seriously persuing and traveling and end up empty hearted and disappointed.
 
tofu pup said:
Looking at puppies is a skill more than anything, and like any skill, you improve with practice. You look at a lot of puppies, and then you look at some more, and then you keep looking. There is always something to learn, and there is always room to improve.
Click to expand...

On Monday I'm going to a well-respected breeder's kennel where she has three litters -- 23 puppies. She and two other "old hands" are going to teach this neophyte how to evaluate puppies. I am so lucky to have been taken in hand by grand mentors. And that includes Lightplum, Tofu Pup and Miss Jennie Girl!!!!
 
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