Heartgard--ivermectin/pyrantel

Smudge said:
They don't always die. All kinds of other scary things can happen to them. They can have seizures from taking that medicine.

I would seriously question a vet's credibility that would sell you heartguard knowing you were giving it to a sheltie.

Do you have a link to the study? :confused2:
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Agreed Smudge!!!! and all umm well most of the vets agree.
 
Megansmom said:
TY for the thread on this..If I read it correctly it stated dogs being given HIGH dosages to treat unresponsive mange were the ones who ended up with high toxicities from it!?
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For those of you that don't know, Smudge has had red mange (with the hereditary weak immune system that goes with it). Ivermectin was a treatment option. There is no way I was taking a chance. :no:

Vet's forget sometimes about this, which is understandable. They work in a busy setting, sometimes with very rude patients. Not to mention a LOT of different dog breeds. Once I reminded him, his eye bulged out like he coudn't believe he forgot, and he apologized. :lol:
 
SheltieGuy said:
http://www.illinoissheltierescue.com/seizures.html

PLEASE read this link. (it doesnt affect ALL shelties but why chance it?) but I am no vet so do what you think is best for your dog. I would at least get a second opinion............just my 2 cents. :)
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TY for the link!! It was encouraging to read that not ALL have a problem with it but that just like people, a select few do.

It was also encouraging to read that Sentinel is a great alternative which is what she is currently takes :wink2:
 
I personally wouldn't take the chance with Ivermectin. Stick to interceptor or sentinel. They're both the same. Sentinel just has another chemical in it to protect against fleas.
 
SheltieGuy said:
I use Interceptor... same thing with out Ivermectin.. (works for me ) :yes:
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I use interceptor as well. Works great for my dogs. I originally used sentinel, but it was expensive. Bailey is also on k9 advantix, so she doesn't really need the flea protection that sentinel has.
 
JessicaR said:
I have always used heartguard (with ivermectin) on my dogs. First with my border collies now with my shelties. My vet told me that in the clinical studies 1 collie did die from ivermectin, but that dog was given 100 times the reccommended dose. No shelties died during the study.
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Thank you!:yes:

I could'nt find the site that I also read that on.I am on borrowed laptop.But yes...this is exactly what I had read also.It hasto be a very igh dose.

I do know,our local feed & seed store,which is where I actually do a quite a bit of business with.I was asking questions about equine ivermectin. As I know several folks,that have more than 2 dogs(all labs),and they use equine ivermectin for heartworm preventative.

The staff at the store told me that in no instance should a dog be givin ivermectin,if they have not been tested for heartworm.The test must be negative. As it will kill any dog if administered,and they in fact are positive for heartworm.

They will NOT even sell you the product if you have a collie or sheltie.

I am fortunate that I have been givin a year supply of Revolution for both dogs here.When the supply has been used,I'll either continue with revolution or use another product that is safe for both dogs.
 
here are some of the studies I have found
http://www.marvistavet.com/html/ivermectin.html

http://www.veterinarypartner.com/Content.plx?P=A&S=0&C=0&A=518

http://heartgard.us.merial.com/pdf/Dog_information.pdf

mbfrench, my vet said that is one of the biggest thing that started the whole dont give your dog heartgard. Breeders were giving their dogs ivermectin for cattle and horses to there dogs because it is cheaper to give them the cattle ivermectin than the stuff for dogs. but the problem was people were not measuring out the amount right and overdosing their dogs. Since you should only give 0.0015 to 0.003 mg per pound of the cattle ivermectin, it is very hard to measure out such a small dose. I do know some people that do it, but I have not been brave enough to try it.
 
JessicaR said:
here are some of the studies I have found
http://www.marvistavet.com/html/ivermectin.html

http://www.veterinarypartner.com/Content.plx?P=A&S=0&C=0&A=518

http://heartgard.us.merial.com/pdf/Dog_information.pdf

mbfrench, my vet said that is one of the biggest thing that started the whole dont give your dog heartgard. Breeders were giving their dogs ivermectin for cattle and horses to there dogs because it is cheaper to give them the cattle ivermectin than the stuff for dogs. but the problem was people were not measuring out the amount right and overdosing their dogs. Since you should only give 0.0015 to 0.003 mg per pound of the cattle ivermectin, it is very hard to measure out such a small dose. I do know some people that do it, but I have not been brave enough to try it.
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Exactly..which when you are looking at that dispenser (long tube with a plunger at the end) you definately want to be knowing what you are doing,or you will witness the death of your dog.
I personally would be scared to death.But these folks I know have used the product for years,and have better confidance than I do.

I had all I could do to admin vaccinations in the beginning,now I have no issues.

Thank you bunches for posting those links!:yes:
 
Megansmom said:
TY for the thread on this..If I read it correctly it stated dogs being given HIGH dosages to treat unresponsive mange were the ones who ended up with high toxicities from it!? Could this mean a dog receiving it in normal healthy dosages would do just fine on it?

Why is it Shelties seem to have problems with it but not so much in other breeds? I know we had our Golden on it for his entire life!!!

TY again..:yes:
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It is related to the MDR1 gene mutation, which effects the blood/brain barrier and makes it leaky. Ivermectin only has problem in dogs that are carriers of the gene or have double mutate genes. According to washington State Unv. that does that testing forthe gene. 15% of shelties population is either a carrier or affected. As opposed to 70% of collies and 50% Aussies. Really any herding breed can carry it. Also any heartworm preventative(Selamectin(revolution), milbemycin(interceptor), and moxidectin( Proheart 6) can be a problem at higher doses just like ivermectin. Ivermectin was the first drug to be noticed. In the small doses Ivermectin is present in heartgard,it is as safe as any of the other preventatives. The amount present was lowered years ago in light of the discovery of the MDR1 gene. Now the higher doses use to treat mange that's a different matter. So please watch your dogs following any medication you give them.

The real problem occurs when people go to the feed store and buy swine or cattle invermectin and formulate they own preventative and end up overdosing the dog.

My dogs are not MDr1 carriers and have taking heartgard for years with no problems. Anyone can get their dogs tested.

Here is a list of the other problems drugs.
http://www.vetmed.wsu.edu/depts-VCPL/drugs.aspx
 
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