jomuir
Forums Enthusiast
I am echoing ghggp's suggestion to catch it on film. The smartphones these days can do a great job, then you can just show it to your new vet.
Lily's Second Seizure
- Thread starter Lisadale
- Start date
another thot
I have a friend with a rottie mix, that breed is prone to seizures and gastric distress. Her quest has been to eliminate the seizures and clear the bloating, air gulping, and excessive swallowing like there is something lodged in its throat. They are die hard naturalists so won't use meds. But here is something interesting, they have been trying magnesium with very promising results. He is on a totally grain free diet now which helped, but it didn't wipe it out, but with the addition of magnesium he is a changed dog. It has been a month and his health has improved greatly, so thought I would share.
I have a friend with a rottie mix, that breed is prone to seizures and gastric distress. Her quest has been to eliminate the seizures and clear the bloating, air gulping, and excessive swallowing like there is something lodged in its throat. They are die hard naturalists so won't use meds. But here is something interesting, they have been trying magnesium with very promising results. He is on a totally grain free diet now which helped, but it didn't wipe it out, but with the addition of magnesium he is a changed dog. It has been a month and his health has improved greatly, so thought I would share.
Thanks to everyone for the wonderful recommendations. It's been a week since her second seizure. There were three months between the first and the second. Do all of you find that the seizures increase in frequency as the dogs get older? I imagine every situation is unique.
Before Lily had her second seizure, I was seriously considering bringing home a second Sheltie as a friend for Lily. She really needs something faster than me to romp and play with. Would a new puppy hurt or help Lily?
Before Lily had her second seizure, I was seriously considering bringing home a second Sheltie as a friend for Lily. She really needs something faster than me to romp and play with. Would a new puppy hurt or help Lily?
trini
Forums Sage
To answer your first question (and obviously there are many exceptions): in general seizures start on one side of the brain and then with repeated seizure activity they "mirror" on the other side of the brain so the entire brain becomes involved. This is why if the seizures are frequent and fairly severe it is always good to get the dog on anti-seizure meds to limit the frequency. However, what you have described with Lily are definitely not grand mals and if the frequency doesn't progress from where she is now she may never get worse. Our Yoda, who had grand mal clusters, went from once every 6 weeks to almost every day in just 3 years....we had to let him go at 4 years old when life no longer had any real quality time for him. But our two current seizure doggies, Simba and Mickey, have very mild focal seizures and the frequency and duration have not changed in either of them. Mickey is on Gabapentin for his seizures, Simba is not on any anti-seizure meds. So, it really depends on how Lily does over the next months...she may never progress past a mild seizure every 3 months or so. Keep careful records of any seizure activity and it's intensity...and as others have suggested get her on video if possible with each seizure so you have something to show the vets and also good comparison from episode to episode.
As to another pal for Lily: there really is no set answer to this. Seizures can be triggered by so many things...in some dogs seizures are triggered by stress or high levels of activity...some are triggered by certain sounds, lights, foods, etc. How does Lily react to having other dogs around...esp puppies? If she is happy and relaxed with other dogs, chances are that adding a pup would be fine as long as the usual rules of giving the adult dog puppy-free time when they obviously have had enough play can be applied.
One word of caution when you have both a dog with seizures and other dog/s. Seizures can be initially disturbing to other dogs and although most other dogs will simply back off or will show gentle concern that their pal is acting abnormally...once in a while you will find a dog who is best friends with a seizure doggie but will attack their friend during a seizure. I suspect this is a "pack security" behavior...ie a dog who is not well is a danger to the security of the pack should an emergency arise. Luckily this negative reaction is rare in our domestic pets, but if you do get another dog just keep alert the first few times Lily might have a seizure and check for your other dog's reaction to make sure it is not edgy/aggressive in any way.
Other than that I think it is so important to give a totally normal life to a dog who may have a seizure problem...and that includes letting them have doggie "siblings" to bond to and play with.
Trini
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wouldn't do it
I think Trini is right...I wouldn't bring another dog into the picture with the seizing going on. It might make her worse, and I don't think it would be right for the other dog to introduce them into that environment. Different scenario if they have always been together. My previous girl wasn't herself after a seizure and it took her awhile to get reoriented, usually about an hr before she was confident and steady on her feet again, and I know that frightened her. Sick pets don't like their world to be altered, it increases their own stress and anxiety and that is a trigger for ones prone to seizures, so why go there is my reasoning. Make them as comfortable as possible, with lots of reassurance, don't overload them with new stuff, ya know? You don't want her to get fearful that you want to replace her, besides adding another dog or pet is not an easy task in the best of households, tensions arise and adjustment time is needed. Kaleigh went beserk when I added Savannah, she drooled like a St Bernard the 1st day-it was gross, she did all kinds of weird stuff that 1st week, and she liked Savannah but it was just her way of reacting to the newer pup invading her domain, and Kaleigh is a laid back girl and was still a puppy herself, so more flexible than a grownup dog would be.
I think Trini is right...I wouldn't bring another dog into the picture with the seizing going on. It might make her worse, and I don't think it would be right for the other dog to introduce them into that environment. Different scenario if they have always been together. My previous girl wasn't herself after a seizure and it took her awhile to get reoriented, usually about an hr before she was confident and steady on her feet again, and I know that frightened her. Sick pets don't like their world to be altered, it increases their own stress and anxiety and that is a trigger for ones prone to seizures, so why go there is my reasoning. Make them as comfortable as possible, with lots of reassurance, don't overload them with new stuff, ya know? You don't want her to get fearful that you want to replace her, besides adding another dog or pet is not an easy task in the best of households, tensions arise and adjustment time is needed. Kaleigh went beserk when I added Savannah, she drooled like a St Bernard the 1st day-it was gross, she did all kinds of weird stuff that 1st week, and she liked Savannah but it was just her way of reacting to the newer pup invading her domain, and Kaleigh is a laid back girl and was still a puppy herself, so more flexible than a grownup dog would be.
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trini
Forums Sage
I guess my comments were not stated clearly and for that I apologize...I didn't mean to indicate that bringing in another dog was either unwise or unfair as long as the dog/s in question enjoy the company of other animals.
Basically I think it is most important to keep the life of a little dog who has seizures as full, happy and normal as possible and that includes having doggie "siblings"(if they enjoy other animals). 99% of the time a dog who has seizures is normal and has the same needs and enjoys the same pleasures as a dog who never has seizures. To limit their life experiences just because they have seizures would limit the quality of their life...and that would be unfair.
The reaction another sibling dog/s will learn to have to a seizure will typically depend on how the owner reacts. If the human doesn't make a big drama out of the seizure, stays calm and reassuring to both the seizure doggie and any other dog/s...then the other dog/s will learn that the seizures are not something they need to be stressed about.
Obviously if there are identifiable triggers, these need to be eliminated as much as possible...but otherwise it is best to treat a dog with seizures no differently from a non-seizure dog.
Trini
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Lily had a third event today. Help needed.
This evening, Lily began acting like she had something stuck in her throat (she had just eaten a piece of chicken). She started frothing at the mouth. When I tried to help, she wrinkled up her lips and continued to lick her mouth. Her eyes weren't closed, and she didn't drop to the ground. She passed a large bowel movement during the event. The whole thing lasted maybe a minute at most.
I tried to capture it on my I-Phone, but realized after the fact that the camera was aimed at everything other than Lily.
Does this sound like a seizure?
This evening, Lily began acting like she had something stuck in her throat (she had just eaten a piece of chicken). She started frothing at the mouth. When I tried to help, she wrinkled up her lips and continued to lick her mouth. Her eyes weren't closed, and she didn't drop to the ground. She passed a large bowel movement during the event. The whole thing lasted maybe a minute at most.
I tried to capture it on my I-Phone, but realized after the fact that the camera was aimed at everything other than Lily.
Does this sound like a seizure?
trini
Forums Sage
Definitely sounds like a seizure and is an escalation in severity from the previous 2. If your vet is still not being responsive to your concerns, I would definitely take her to another vet immediately. At this point she will probably be started on anti-seizure meds.
I am so sorry...I know this is very scary emotionally...but Lily can still have a wonderful life with the proper medical care.
Trini
Caro
Moderator
I'm sorry to hear Lily had another seizure. Lip licking or lip smacking can be a sign of epileptic seizure, you don't always have to see full body convulsions, sometimes the involuntary movements are just to one part of the body. The movements can be as small as rapid eye blinking and a loss of awareness. So she could have had more than the 3 you and your mother have noticed.
I agree with Trini - time to talk to a vet about medicating. While it is heartbreaking, she can have a full and active life with epilepsy.
I agree with Trini - time to talk to a vet about medicating. While it is heartbreaking, she can have a full and active life with epilepsy.
Thank you all for your responses.
After I posted, I found a very educational but scary video on You Tube showing a Sheltie going through both petit mal and grand mal seizures. The petit mal seizures in the video looked exactly like what Lily had experienced.
Lily had another petit mal seizure at 9:30 when she was in her crate for bed. I let her out and she seemed to immediately recover, although she did lose her bowels again. I called the on-call vet who advised me to set up an appointment today.
Lily was crate-trained as a puppy and still feels most comfortable sleeping there at night or when we leave the house. We've tried to encourage her to sleep outside the crate but with no success. Is the crate a safe place for her during a seizure?
On a side-note, has anyone noticed an increase in seizures after using Frontline? The doctor did tell me Lily couldn't take one of the oral flea medications, but I wonder if the topical ones have equal problems?
I appreciate all of your advice and encouragement. I've always had a dog in my life (including three Shelties), and have never experienced seizures. It's been a scary time for all of us, and I thank you all for making it easier to understand.
After I posted, I found a very educational but scary video on You Tube showing a Sheltie going through both petit mal and grand mal seizures. The petit mal seizures in the video looked exactly like what Lily had experienced.
Lily had another petit mal seizure at 9:30 when she was in her crate for bed. I let her out and she seemed to immediately recover, although she did lose her bowels again. I called the on-call vet who advised me to set up an appointment today.
Lily was crate-trained as a puppy and still feels most comfortable sleeping there at night or when we leave the house. We've tried to encourage her to sleep outside the crate but with no success. Is the crate a safe place for her during a seizure?
On a side-note, has anyone noticed an increase in seizures after using Frontline? The doctor did tell me Lily couldn't take one of the oral flea medications, but I wonder if the topical ones have equal problems?
I appreciate all of your advice and encouragement. I've always had a dog in my life (including three Shelties), and have never experienced seizures. It's been a scary time for all of us, and I thank you all for making it easier to understand.