"Poshies" Seriously?!

[Mignarda]

This is raising red flags for me. We got our jack from a breeder/kennel from hell
down in skuykill haven, PA. They were breeding both poms & shelties. Those poor dogs never stood a chance -the place was a hell hole & the people were the worst of humanity (long story & it makes me sick to even think about it) -Jack 'still" isn't right & it's been almost 2 years.
If the breeder is from that area -steer clear! They are liars & cheats as well as being irresponsible breeders.
I don't want to mention there name for obvious reasons.

I understand there are lots of puppy mills in that region.

 

[Tagg]

There are many reasons that people buy designer breeds but the biggest one is their belief that it will be healthier than a purebred. Sad, but true, many breeders breed for looks and leave health and temperament a distant second and third. Purebred used to stand for quality, predicability and support. How many on this forum have gotten a dog that is now having genetic or congenital issues and the breeder "doesn't want to know". How many times have I heard that the contract expired, or doesn't cover an issue that it should. I tell buyers all the time that NO reputable breeder would ever sell an animal to someone that was planning to breed it to another breed so they can be sure that no testing for possible problems will have been done on their breeding animals. I would love to tell them that they also don't have the back up that purebred dog breeders SHOULD give in the event of inherant illness.
Now that the CKC is considering opening up performance events to non purebred dogs, there is even less incentive to buy a registerable animal.

 

[Sharon7]

I have seen two dogs at our shelter that sure look like Pom/Sheltie crosses. One is there now. He's an adorable bi-black with a curly tail. I did a double take when I saw him, he really looks like a blend of the two breeds.

I too roll my eyes over these "designer breeds" I get people mad when I call them mutts, but really....

We have a LOT of Chiweenies come thru our shelter, it seems to be the popular thing here. (Dachshund X Chihuahua).

 

[HopeShelties]

Now that the CKC is considering opening up performance events to non purebred dogs, there is even less incentive to buy a registerable animal.

That is something I tried to drive home to the sheltie breeders on a particular facebook group, but they got ugly claiming I was 'jealous of mutts beating my dogs' in agility and didn't want to hear it. They claimed it was good for the purebred breeds. Yes, bring them in and let them see what the purebreds can do and they will go out and buy them!
IMO, AKC was just looking for another way to bring in money. The trials around here were already filling.
Before, if they wanted to play in AKC, they needed either a purebred dog from a breeder, or a dog who could be ILP'd. Now, that incentive is gone. A large number of the people I know in my area with mixed breeds are of the 'adopt don't shop!' mentality. They aren't going to go out and buy a purebred just because they see the nice purebreds at the AKC agility trials. Several are anti-breeder. After all, us bad breeders are taking away homes from those poor pups in the pound who could make every bit as nice an agility dog without adding to the population. It also opens the door for the intentionally bred mixes for agility. Borderjacks, Borderstaffys, Borderwhippets... They are going to become a bigger part of the game with people who want to be competitive. There was a big name former world team handler who came to speak and hold a seminar here back in the fall. Part of it was on agility trends. She said mixed breeds are the next big thing. She also said she planned for her next dog to be a mixed breed. You can be sure if the big names start doing that, there is going to be a trickle down effect, and even more are going to seek out these purpose bred mixes (largely from flyball breeders).
I'm probably in the minority, but I do believe a purebred dog registry should be only open to purebred dogs, and the promotion of them. In the current climate, with the 'adopt dont shop' mentality, peta, and hsus, it isn't doing the purebred breeds, or breeders any favors to bring the mixed breeds into AKC or CKC performance events. They aren't excluded from agility in general. ASCA, CPE, NADAC, TDAA, UKI, and USDAA were already open to mixed breed dogs. However, people wanting to participate in AKC, our purebred registries events, should own/adopt a purebred/ilp registerable dog. Bringing them in through allowing them to compete with their mixed breed isn't going to help get them to go out and buy a purebred.

 

[Mignarda]

The trouble with breeding purebreds, where a certain physical standard is required, is that it is simply not humanly possible to select for every phenotype that a species requires for the sum of its needed traits. Nature, on the other hand, takes care of this, especially in social mammals, simply because (in my opinion) those members of a population, the totality of whose phenotypes are the most adaptive, get to survive, be socially dominant, and reproduce. There's no "guiding hand" in this; it simply happens. Continually trying to breed for a small subset of physical qualities is eventually going to cause problems, because obviously in order to retain those qualities you're going to need to inbreed to a certain extent.

 

[celloyogi]

I'm probably in the minority, but I do believe a purebred dog registry should be only open to purebred dogs, and the promotion of them. In the current climate, with the 'adopt dont shop' mentality, peta, and hsus, it isn't doing the purebred breeds, or breeders any favors to bring the mixed breeds into AKC or CKC performance events. They aren't excluded from agility in general. ASCA, CPE, NADAC, TDAA, UKI, and USDAA were already open to mixed breed dogs. However, people wanting to participate in AKC, our purebred registries events, should own/adopt a purebred/ilp registerable dog. Bringing them in through allowing them to compete with their mixed breed isn't going to help get them to go out and buy a purebred.

Well said. And I agree you that a purebred registry should only be open to purebreds. I completely understand owners of mixed breed dogs wanting to participate in the competitions available to owners of purebred dogs - why not just have a completely separate organization, and if they really want to match things up, have the two groups go for a championship? Kind of like the World Series, with the National and American Leagues.

And seriously... borderstaffys? Borderjacks? Geez, in humans we have hGH and in dogs I guess some people try to breed in the equivalent to get around the rules. Sketchy.

 

[Caro]

Now that the CKC is considering opening up performance events to non purebred dogs, there is even less incentive to buy a registerable animal.

Over here the ANKC is open for non-purebreds to register to allow them to compete in ANKC sports. There are 2 pure-bred registers - main and limited and 2 non-purebred registers - sporting and associate. To be on the sporting register the dog has to be registered with an ANKC approved sporting association, which includes working dog associations. On the limited register dogs have to be desexed before they can be registered. Most of the associate dogs I see at agility are rescues, very few designer dogs. And I think that's fair (and many people with multiple dogs have a rescue). Most of the sporting register dogs are working kelpies.

 

[solopompom]

Shocked at nasty comment about POSHIES??..

First of all ..I have the most beautiful handsome POSHIE that ive come across since i bought what i thought to be a POMERANIAN..Yes, Yes im a fool! .. Anyway.. Breeders who experiment or cause harm anyway shape or form are the MUTTS..the ACCIDENTS!! ..coverups etc..Im really sick to my tummy at the words id use to describe an evil IMP OR WORSE.. Animal abusing idiots.
Anyway I realised after a few mths that my pom pom was changing cvolour and size and everything on a weekly basis..I have A beautiful and ACCIDENT perchased POSHIE U HAVE CVLAPPED THOSE EYES ON ...

I'll show u just how wrong your description was and even if it isint to ur taste..you talk about an inicent animal like its not fit to breath!! not good x

 

[Calliesmom]

First of all ..I have the most beautiful handsome POSHIE that ive come across since i bought what i thought to be a POMERANIAN..Yes, Yes im a fool! .. Anyway.. Breeders who experiment or cause harm anyway shape or form are the MUTTS..the ACCIDENTS!! ..coverups etc..Im really sick to my tummy at the words id use to describe an evil IMP OR WORSE.. Animal abusing idiots.
Anyway I realised after a few mths that my pom pom was changing cvolour and size and everything on a weekly basis..I have A beautiful and ACCIDENT perchased POSHIE U HAVE CVLAPPED THOSE EYES ON ...

I'll show u just how wrong your description was and even if it isint to ur taste..you talk about an inicent animal like its not fit to breath!! not good x

nobody is/was bashing the innocent dog- only the humans trying to make money by selling mixed breed dogs as something really special therefore costing twice as much as a purebred dog from a reputable breeder.......

 

[seashel]

It is believed that there was at least one Pomeranian or small spitz in the early breeding of shelties, hence there was a big problem eradicating so called 'apple heads' in the breed, also the high set tail may be at least partially due to pom/spitz heritage. These 'problems' still crop up today. Shelties have a lot of mixed breeding behind them, the rough collie crosses were done overtly and covertly but further back there was the probable Icelandic dog (another spitz type) which may have contributed to the dark 'yakki' muzzles occasionally seen in sable pups. (Here in the UK - don't know if they occur in the States?).

I am absolutely not in agreement with thoughtless crossing of breeds with no intention beyond producing a mix with a 'cute name'. It is my belief that if labradoodles had been called Labrador x poodle they would never have become such a phenomenon. However, I do think there is a place for considered cross breeding, whether to eradicate a serious genetic condition (LUA Dalmations/Pointer crossing) or to develop a dog for a particular purpose as has always been the case.

Of all the various 'designer' cross breeds I have come across, the overwhelming majority have been super dogs with great temperament. Providing anyone purchasing one realises there is no guarantees how it will turn out (some labradoodles look like labs some look like poodles and some look like Spinones) and no guarantee it will be healthier than a purebred. However there is a terrible issue with overbreeding, bad breeding (BYB) appalling marketing hype which drives the reputation of these crosses into disrepute. Responsibly done, between breeds that are compatible and done for a specific purpose there is a place for it. I've seen some beautiful Papillion x border collies running in agility for example. Badly done, crossing different breeds can bring horrendous problems - why for instance would any sane person cross bassett hounds with shar peis???

Personally I love that in the UK, all our performance competitions are open to all breeds and mixes. This makes dog training more relevant to all dog owners and is great credit to the KC. It is just as fun competing with a mixed breed as any other and people may be more likely to consider a purebred next having 'tried out' with their first dog than if they had been excluded. The KC also runs a mixed breed 'conformation' show - 'Scrufts' and in 2014 held the finals at Crufts. So even at the premier event you are likely to see a non-purebred dog. I don't feel this in anyway demeans purebred dogs.