Revolving Door Syndrome

[Ron Atkinson]

I have had a Sheltie in my life for over 30 plus continuous years and 2 came from breeders and the 3rd came from the pound. When I was looking for my 3rd Sheltie I was not approved by a rescue for 2 reasons 1 My yard didn't have a fence they liked and 2 I was over 60 years old. I had good references from the 2 Vet Clinics we use.
So I went to a small breeder that has a good reputation where I live. Teddy gets more exercise than a lot of dogs and we still play in our backyard together. I am at the point in my life were I want and need a dog in my life so if I need to use a breeder I will. And I love the Sheltie breed over all the others.

 

[Piper's mom]

I'm with you, Ron. This is why I have six dogs. I'm an epic fail at "rehoming" them, something frequently done with show dogs who either don't take to the show ring or don't measure up. Once a dog joins our family, it is with us for life. They are pets first, show dogs second and we love them all.

I do understand that breeders have to place their retired dogs to make room for others, and most are very careful about finding them great homes. But I'll never understand how you give up a pet unless it's dangerous. Many people don't want to put in the time and effort it takes to train a dog or puppy unfortunately, and Covid has added to the problem with the people who decided a dog was a terrific idea while in lockdown. Now, returning to normal, it's not as easy and I fear many of those pandemic puppies will end up in shelters.

I hope your neighbors figure out that puppies don't come ready made with manners and training, and their first one has found a home with better owners.

I remember a conversation I had with a stranger when Piper was about a year old. I was in a garden centre with Piper and a gentleman commented on how pretty Piper was. He asked if I had shown him and I said no, that he has lance canines. This man’s response was that he was a waste of money! I was disgusted with this guy and wanted to clock him one but I held my tongue and thought what a waste of skin HE was!

 

[Ron Atkinson]

Ann,
I honestly don't know how you do it I remember that picture you shared with your pack sitting so nicely together looking like they were ready for a night out on the town.
You could see they looked happy and healthy.
The training you do with them is way more intense for the show ring than what I do with Teddy. I am happy with him being a kind dog to people and other animals an listening and doing my other basic commands which I think we have been successful
You have done that and more.

You are Awesome!!

Now if I could get him to not bark his fool head off at every tradesman or service technician that comes to the house he would be great.

 

[Sandy in CT]

I'd much rather see a dog owner admit they made a mistake and get the dog to a better place than wait until the dog has developed all kinds of issues from neglect and behavioral issues from lack of training.

I agree with this. I don't always feel a dog and a family are a fit. I don't understand that family going out and getting another dog though! There is a family on the road near us; can't tell you how many dogs they've been through. They are repeat adopters, good in a way, but the dog runs away, is left outside, one dog kept running through their electric fence then got out during a bitterly, bitterly cold spell we had. We live in an area with bear, coyote, fox, bobcats - I tell you these people have been through more dogs - I have no clue why places kept adopting to them. I reported them a few times for leaving a dog outside during snowstorms. I think they are dog-less now, but man, what a sad thing that was.

I can't imagine being in rescue and trying to place dogs who have been surrendered. I think those folks are angels. It really must be heart wrenching to go to the problem of getting a dog healthy even to be placed in a home, going to the trouble of finding out the dogs personality and quirks, taking the time to vet prospective families, placing a dog only to have it returned due to ignorant people.

 

[Ann]

Ann,
I honestly don't know how you do it I remember that picture you shared with your pack sitting so nicely together looking like they were ready for a night out on the town.
You could see they looked happy and healthy.
The training you do with them is way more intense for the show ring than what I do with Teddy. I am happy with him being a kind dog to people and other animals an listening and doing my other basic commands which I think we have been successful
You have done that and more.

You are Awesome!!

Now if I could get him to not bark his fool head off at every tradesman or service technician that comes to the house he would be great.

Thanks so much for the kind words, Ron. I was lucky enough to have a wonderful mentor to learn from who had done the early training on my first show dogs, Checkers and Lacey, and taught me everything from training to grooming to showing. I didn't start showing until I was 60, coming from the world of horses, although I'd always had Shelties. Now in my 70s, the dogs give me a reason to get up every day and showing is a fun pastime with them. Aside from our family, they are the light of hubby's and my lives.

Hah, if you find a solution for that barking there are a LOT of people who'd love to know it, including me!

 

[Bailey's Mom]

I remember a conversation I had with a stranger when Piper was about a year old. I was in a garden centre with Piper and a gentleman commented on how pretty Piper was. He asked if I had shown him and I said no, that he has lance canines. This man’s response was that he was a waste of money! I was disgusted with this guy and wanted to clock him one but I held my tongue and thought what a waste of skin HE was!

What are the odds this guy actually knows anything about show animals?

I say this as someone who has never shown a dog but who found her last dog because as my husband and I joke she washed out of show dog school. We were so blessed because she was just what Katy needed when Bailey passed and I can't imagine our family without her. However, in the years I've met people who do show dogs all seemed to be clearly aware that some dogs will end up as pets because for one reason or another they aren't suited for show. Contrary to all the horrid stories out there breeders do make arrangements for these dogs and those of us who are lucky enough to find one greatly benefit from the experience. That doesn't include the dogs who retire after their show years are finished and also make their ways into retirement as pets.

I know all of you are aware of this but I do find it weird when people make ignorant comments that indicate really understand.

 

[Bailey's Mom]

I agree with this. I don't always feel a dog and a family are a fit. I don't understand that family going out and getting another dog though! There is a family on the road near us; can't tell you how many dogs they've been through. They are repeat adopters, good in a way, but the dog runs away, is left outside, one dog kept running through their electric fence then got out during a bitterly, bitterly cold spell we had. We live in an area with bear, coyote, fox, bobcats - I tell you these people have been through more dogs - I have no clue why places kept adopting to them. I reported them a few times for leaving a dog outside during snowstorms. I think they are dog-less now, but man, what a sad thing that was.

I can't imagine being in rescue and trying to place dogs who have been surrendered. I think those folks are angels. It really must be heart wrenching to go to the problem of getting a dog healthy even to be placed in a home, going to the trouble of finding out the dogs personality and quirks, taking the time to vet prospective families, placing a dog only to have it returned due to ignorant people.

I've said for years Bailey's foster Mom was such an amazing woman. When we went back to get Katy I was devestated to hear she'd passed from cancer. Her work with Bailey was amazing. When I tell people I adopted a house broken puppy they can't believe it, but it was so much more than that. She was incredibly supportive as we were working through the adoption process. It was my first dog as an adult, although I'd been raised with dogs as a child and it was my DH's first ever dog or for that matter pet. She was so helpful with questions, answers, etc. She was a breeder and working with rescue was her way of giving back to the community of animals she loved is what she told us when we met.

I also realize many rescues are all volunteers. Sometimes they do become closed off to outsiders as it is easier to work with people you know than adding new people and this can be challenging and in talking to rescue groups they are often frustrated they don't get more volunteers but when you ask them about taking on new volunteers you also get this resistance because it it time consuming to train new people. It can be a catch 22.

In this area we have 2 agricultural high schools. Having had a family member attend one I know for the dog care students they are required to find a dog to train for one of the classes. Now this wouldn't solve the severe behavior issues but you have to think if you had dogs with basic behavior training in local rescues it might make them easier to adopt. They also recruit animals from teachers, school families, etc. to practice dog grooming skills on including bathing, cutting, nails,etc. Imagine farming these tasks through the aggie high school for some local rescues. First it lightens the load of the care givers. Two it engages the high school students in working with rescue groups that provides them with something to put on college applications and scholarships, it potentially trains future volunteers who have skills to work in rescues, and lastly it makes the dogs more adoptable. However, nobody seems interested in approaching the high schools or colleges that train for these positions. There could be liablity issues but since they are already bringing in outside animals one would think there are work arounds.

 

[Calliesmom]

I've said for years Bailey's foster Mom was such an amazing woman. When we went back to get Katy I was devestated to hear she'd passed from cancer. Her work with Bailey was amazing. When I tell people I adopted a house broken puppy they can't believe it, but it was so much more than that. She was incredibly supportive as we were working through the adoption process. It was my first dog as an adult, although I'd been raised with dogs as a child and it was my DH's first ever dog or for that matter pet. She was so helpful with questions, answers, etc. She was a breeder and working with rescue was her way of giving back to the community of animals she loved is what she told us when we met.

I also realize many rescues are all volunteers. Sometimes they do become closed off to outsiders as it is easier to work with people you know than adding new people and this can be challenging and in talking to rescue groups they are often frustrated they don't get more volunteers but when you ask them about taking on new volunteers you also get this resistance because it it time consuming to train new people. It can be a catch 22.

In this area we have 2 agricultural high schools. Having had a family member attend one I know for the dog care students they are required to find a dog to train for one of the classes. Now this wouldn't solve the severe behavior issues but you have to think if you had dogs with basic behavior training in local rescues it might make them easier to adopt. They also recruit animals from teachers, school families, etc. to practice dog grooming skills on including bathing, cutting, nails,etc. Imagine farming these tasks through the aggie high school for some local rescues. First it lightens the load of the care givers. Two it engages the high school students in working with rescue groups that provides them with something to put on college applications and scholarships, it potentially trains future volunteers who have skills to work in rescues, and lastly it makes the dogs more adoptable. However, nobody seems interested in approaching the high schools or colleges that train for these positions. There could be liablity issues but since they are already bringing in outside animals one would think there are work arounds.

that really is a great idea- not sure how to implement it but definitely a win-win

 

[Darren]

People should really do their research before rushing out and getting a dog. Too many times I've seen people say "it's not what they expected" so are returning them. What did they expect, a guppy. Dogs are hard work, granted some more than others. People like that really should'nt be pet owners.
I do believe that if they can't look after them correctly then find someone who will rather than give the dog a poor life, BUT DON'T GO GET ANOTHER DOG!!!!!

Personally once I have a dog it's for life. Once Monty had settled into my home he was VERY hard for me to deal with for a while. I just wasn't used to that level of naughiness and crazy but we worked through it and now I have the most funny, caring little dog i could have asked for. He still can be a challenge sometimes but I wouldn't swap him for the world. If I had just given in and taken him back he would have been more mentally scared and I would have missed out on such a special little guy. I feel you should only give in as a last, last resort as you never know what special little soul could be waiting if you just give them a chance.

 

[Bailey's Mom]

People should really do their research before rushing out and getting a dog. Too many times I've seen people say "it's not what they expected" so are returning them. What did they expect, a guppy. Dogs are hard work, granted some more than others. People like that really should'nt be pet owners.
I do believe that if they can't look after them correctly then find someone who will rather than give the dog a poor life, BUT DON'T GO GET ANOTHER DOG!!!!!

Personally once I have a dog it's for life. Once Monty had settled into my home he was VERY hard for me to deal with for a while. I just wasn't used to that level of naughiness and crazy but we worked through it and now I have the most funny, caring little dog i could have asked for. He still can be a challenge sometimes but I wouldn't swap him for the world. If I had just given in and taken him back he would have been more mentally scared and I would have missed out on such a special little guy. I feel you should only give in as a last, last resort as you never know what special little soul could be waiting if you just give them a chance.

I read every book I could find on the topic when we were looking to adopt a Sheltie. Not everyone does. I do think it wouldn't be the worst idea in the world to provide prospective and actual adopters with link and guides to resources that first help them prepare for adoption and then give them ideas of what to do when they need help. Working together groups could easily share these resources and it could be something widely accessed across groups. You'd need to update online resources but again it is a starting point. Breed rescues might have more individualized resources that cite specific issues/challenges care/needs that come up for specific breeds. If our concern is revolving doors education is one way to reduce the return rate.

One question I always see on rescue applications is do you know how much it costs to feed and care for a dog? How about sending people to a place where they can find out what the costs are for that breed or in cases of a mixed breed that general size based on guess of breeds. I hear complaints that people lie on applications but one solution to that is to get them to read the info as part of the adoption process. I have had 3 now so I think I'm kind of numb to the cost but I know its in the monthly budget and its never been an issue in caring for our dogs. However, it can be an reason why people surrender so just telling people dogs can be expensive is less helpful than breaking down the potential monthly/yearly basic costs.

Another question I always have mixed reactions to is will you accept a dog with needs. My answer honestly is it depends. While Bailey was the dog everyone dreams of adopting, Katy had challenges. Sadly we didn't find out most of them until she came home but I NEVER for one minute would have thought about not keeping her. I say sadly, because it took us months to find many of the issues and start to work through the layers. Had we known we'd have been better prepared. It wouldn't have changed my mind about bringing her home. The difference between Katy's challenges and the failed rescue is as challenging and even frustrating at times managing her issues from her previous home were they were just that manageable. We had the skills with help of our Vet to get through it. While I wish she never had been through what she'd been through I can't imagine the last 11 years without her.

What we all owe potential rescuers and the dogs is to know what is doable for that family. I for one can not handle an aggressive dog. I will not do it. I've been honest and upfront about that in any application I've ever put in or discussion I've had with a breeder for placement. If we don't want people to lie we first shouldn't lie to them about the dogs we are placing. Secondly, we should have some compassion for people who are honest about what they can handle. I don't find someone who lies because it looks better on an application and then fails to do what they agreed to a better candidate than someone who is honest and may be harder to find a placement because they can't take the worst behaved dog in the rescue.

There is a big difference from a dog who needs to go to a basic obedience school and one who needs behavioral training. Being honest enough to admit you don't think you have the skills for a more advanced need is honest. Lying is worse for the dog in the long run.