Running Dog Walk

I like to repost Janice Demello reply because that what I would reply too re all those nasty comments posted on various chats/forums
Jan DeMello/Hob Nob border collies says:

"I truly don’t understand why anyone would be so negative about what a person would charge for a training methodology! Many people don’t realize the commitment to putting oneself out there for something they are passionate about and wanting to share. It should not come cheap for it takes years to come to such a place of achievement as any professional in their chosen sport can attest to.

If Michael Jordan did such a workshop for basketball enthusiasts, you can bet the cost would be high (and rightly so) to learn from one of the best basketball players of all time!

Getting to a place of high achievement does not come cheap as people at the top of their chosen field have spent thousands of dollars themselves to ‘perfect their game’ and continue to do so.
Many people benefit from these top professionals whether it is through seminars, private lessons, DVDs etc. The sport of agility should feel fortunate that these individuals are willing to share and put themselves out there and yes, for a price which is as it should be.
If you don’t want to ‘pay the piper’ then you don’t have to follow! Plain and simple."
Few people have power/ ability to influence lives of others. I have taken classes with some good teachers and some not so good ones. It was great blessing that someone on this forum mention SG Crate Games to me. I am a better human because of training I get with SG. And if anyone reads her blog or FB pages, it is full of thankyou notes so it is not just me. SG challenges people to be better humans, to find joy in relationship with their dogs, to learn and to have fun.
As far as what future hold for agility I sincerely hope that there will be enough demand for amateur shows, and maybe even like APDT rally development while some other venues will become more pro and highly competitive.
 
Running Dogwalk

SheltieChe said:
I like to repost Janice Demello reply because that what I would reply too re all those nasty comments posted on various chats/forums
Jan DeMello/Hob Nob border collies says:

"I truly don’t understand why anyone would be so negative about what a person would charge for a training methodology! Many people don’t realize the commitment to putting oneself out there for something they are passionate about and wanting to share. It should not come cheap for it takes years to come to such a place of achievement as any professional in their chosen sport can attest to.

If Michael Jordan did such a workshop for basketball enthusiasts, you can bet the cost would be high (and rightly so) to learn from one of the best basketball players of all time!

Getting to a place of high achievement does not come cheap as people at the top of their chosen field have spent thousands of dollars themselves to ‘perfect their game’ and continue to do so.
Many people benefit from these top professionals whether it is through seminars, private lessons, DVDs etc. The sport of agility should feel fortunate that these individuals are willing to share and put themselves out there and yes, for a price which is as it should be.
If you don’t want to ‘pay the piper’ then you don’t have to follow! Plain and simple."
Few people have power/ ability to influence lives of others. I have taken classes with some good teachers and some not so good ones. It was great blessing that someone on this forum mention SG Crate Games to me. I am a better human because of training I get with SG. And if anyone reads her blog or FB pages, it is full of thankyou notes so it is not just me. SG challenges people to be better humans, to find joy in relationship with their dogs, to learn and to have fun.
As far as what future hold for agility I sincerely hope that there will be enough demand for amateur shows, and maybe even like APDT rally development while some other venues will become more pro and highly competitive.
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Still would not pay $5,000.You can post all the positive stuff you want on SG and no one in thread said she was bad.She is a great trainer but not for $5,000 .
 
lol
I said it before, I used to be a huge SG fan, have and will continue to always recommended crate games and 2x2 weave training DVD or her book about Buzz to name a few. SHe is bloody brilliant!
However, it doesn't make her infallible, to the point where I find people just follow her blindly, like sheep ;) Now I don't blame her, I blame the sheep ;)
lol
I mean instructors who don't have any own original thoughts in their head other than omg what does SG do, how does she train this with Encore, Feature, Decaf, Swagger.. etc etc.. Susan is an innovator in the sport, so why do some of those blind followers not try and be more creative themselves instead of trying to be cookie cutter replicas... Right down to Susan's terminology, words for the toys, dogs and herself... Mind you they could have chosen much worse role models, lol However, Susan always comes up with new things, so should her sheep :biggrin2:

Sorry, just had a terrible run in with one of those and I am beyond disappointed, because cookie cutter never did work with ALL dogs, lol. Susan isn't advocating this herself, so nope I don't blame her, learn as much as I can afford and hang on to every word she says... but I do continue to think for myself, and she wouldn't be a friend of mine, that's for sure, too A type ;) But I doubt she misses the loss of my potential friendship, LOL
 
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I'm with Sharon. Still wouldn't pay it. Don't believe it's worth it.
And my reply to her post is... look back at my post about those at the top of the game in the Saddlebred world. They are SGs equivalent in their world, and they aren't commanding those prices, and they even do all of the work for the owners. I have been to pretty exclusive seminars with some of the best in the industry, for training secrets that are less readily available than in the agility world, and I wasn't paying anything more than a few hundred dollars at most. In the Saddlebred world, there aren't videos. There aren't books (besides Helen Crabtree's equitation book, and an old vague one or two on training), and there are very few seminars.
 
For the heck of it, I scoured the internet to see what others were saying about this. Some commented that this was the best ever marketing ploy...ever! I guess the thing is, as long as there are people paying for it, she can charge it. I bet you, if she charged $25k per dog, she'd still get people to sign up. That's how desperate some people can be for the "perfect" contacts. A lot of people were commenting on how with the Recallers course, if you didn't pay the big bucks, you were ignored. That's sad. And I guess she's really not well-liked to begin with. Interesting.

IMHO, she's becoming a "sell-out" in the eyes of many agility people. She's selling and people are buying! Half the people think no one else can teach them what she can. The other half, this $5k RC thing pushed them away even further from her.

I can't wait to see who she trains. IMHO, depending on the dogs she trains will determine if I'll still respect her in the morning. lol.

I believe the agility world is split with this $5k RC course. Either people now dislike her and her methodologies, or people respect her marketing skills. I'm falling into the former, because this sport isn't a "pro" sport. Next thing you know, we'll be PAYING HER to run her dogs in agility, and we'll be paying entry fees to WATCH her run her dogs. Oh wait, we already kinda do.
 
My opinion.....

If people are willing to pay it, then all the power to her.

In this day and age, I am happy that she is out there, making a living, doing what she loves.

I say, go for it!

Although, you would never find me paying for that kind of training. I have to feed my kids :lol:
 
k9kreationz said:
For the heck of it, I scoured the internet to see what others were saying about this. Some commented that this was the best ever marketing ploy...ever! I guess the thing is, as long as there are people paying for it, she can charge it. I bet you, if she charged $25k per dog, she'd still get people to sign up. That's how desperate some people can be for the "perfect" contacts. A lot of people were commenting on how with the Recallers course, if you didn't pay the big bucks, you were ignored. That's sad. And I guess she's really not well-liked to begin with. Interesting.

IMHO, she's becoming a "sell-out" in the eyes of many agility people. She's selling and people are buying! Half the people think no one else can teach them what she can. The other half, this $5k RC thing pushed them away even further from her.

I can't wait to see who she trains. IMHO, depending on the dogs she trains will determine if I'll still respect her in the morning. lol.

I believe the agility world is split with this $5k RC course. Either people now dislike her and her methodologies, or people respect her marketing skills. I'm falling into the former, because this sport isn't a "pro" sport. Next thing you know, we'll be PAYING HER to run her dogs in agility, and we'll be paying entry fees to WATCH her run her dogs. Oh wait, we already kinda do.
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The thing I do not understand why so much venom? It is not like this world does not operate on strange values already- just because designer label clothing cost fortune I do not go to the storefront and throw rotten eggs there:lol: kids out of high school get to sign millions $$ contracts if he can throw a ball, actors get paid for one lousy soap opera episode what others don't get paid in a year- this is society we live in, why suddenly so much righteousness?
And agility world is evolving, whether anyone wants it on not, nothing stands still and it is new sport. Will it develop after horse sports? Will it take new twists? Hopefully as there will be demand from weekend warriors there will be supply of trials... but when wins start coming because one dog is faster then other by 0.0001 sec it sure means changes are coming :yes: and we likely to see some branches into pro sports or divisions or whatever... its life, why b!@#$ about it?
and statement about recallers is just plain BS. EVERYONE has same games homework, same FAQ, same seminars and webinars... forum operates not unlike this one- everyone gets to post questions and if I have an idea I can chime in, some questions get more responses and some less, and unless you tell me I would not know which level you are in. Sure there are levels with different perks and IC has its own forum with additional monthly seminar. But it is more like Hopesheltie was saying earlier. It is not up to the course or SG- it depends how good I am as a trainer, how much I am willing to put in and how many changes I am willing to make. Recallers 3.0 is officially finished but people created recallers redoers group and going over games again as a group right there on forum.
Sheesh, if that is what agility world looks like on the top I do not know if I want to even travel that route, all that snake venom might be poisonous:eek2:
 
Running Dogwalk

Oh please what venom? Not everyone is a SG fan and personally I think she has some great stuff but feel she is commercializing on it.There is nothing she could teach me or my dog that my own trainer can't and my trainer is a 5 time world team member and first person to ever win a gold for USA and I did not pay her 5k.:biggrin2:
 
just to clarify, I was not referring to this forum, I think people as usual are very civil here. Few other places dog/agility related just make me feel very sad for them reading many nasty poisonous comments, hopefully nobody will get a stroke worrying what SG will do with all those $$$:lol:
 
ETA: just saw your post SheltieChe, but for now, I'll just leave mine up.

I have no "venom" towards SG at all. I believe she's a great trainer. But you're comparing apples to oranges with the designer clothing industry. First of all, the clothing industry is 100% marketing. The agility world is not. Clothing is designed and made to be sold. Agility is not. If agility turns into anything like the pro sports, I'll be very very disappointed. And SG, IMHO, is doing just that by charging the $5k. I just don't want to see the agility world turn into the pro sports world.

Yes, everything evolves, but I would hope that agility doesn't evolve into a sport where even the elite have to pay thousands and thousands of dollars. Basically, it'll push out every hobbyist who then wouldn't be able to pay for training, seminars, or trials. I mean, ask yourself, would you do agility of all of a sudden a weekend trial cost $500 for an entry because now there was prize money for 1st, 2nd, and 3rd places? Would you pay $5,000 for a 3-day seminar? Would you pay $100 per training session? What if prices were higher? Which of us would no longer be doing agility? If agility turned into that (due to evolution as you say), I know for a fact that I'd quit and in fact, I'd try to create my own group in which fees aren't that high. Actually, I bet the "market" wouldn't even sustain those prices.

As for the recallers class, as I was reading about the $5k issue, I saw a lot of people discuss their experience with recallers. Many of them were very disappointed in how if you didn't pay the higher fee, they were basically ignored when they asked questions. They said they learned a lot, but at the same time, you could tell that it was more about money than "helping" people learn. I'm just repeating things I read. So it's not BS. People out there feel that way. Not everyone, but yes, people feel jipped.

Lastly, I have no clue what the people "up there" are thinking or feeling. I'm not up there and I know maybe 1 or 2 people personally who are kind of up there. All I wrote was my own opinion and I'm way way way down there. I'm no one in the world of agility and that's why I think it's a crying shame what SG is doing.

In this world, if you have money, you get the "best of the best". When I first started out in agility, I felt like, "wow, almost anyone can be good, money or not. As long as you put the time into it, you can be great, heck you don't even need to pay for training." If SG starts turning this into a "only those with money get the goods" then that is what is disappointing to me. And I'm afraid because others will see what she can charge, they'll start charging more too.

That's why I wish she didn't do this and why I'm disappointed in the whole thing. Maybe it won't happen, but she's opened a door that will never close. I'm curious to see where the agility world will be in the next 10 years. And if it's become a big marketing arena, then yes, there will be venom from me. until then, no venom, just very disappointed in her.
 
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