To debark or not to debark

I had a Papillon for 14 years prior to getting Spencer and she came to me debarked. What the debarking did for her was prevent that high pitched yelping that toy dogs often do. She still could bark, but it was softer and lower in tone. Believe me, neither her life nor her health were in any way impacted by the debarking. She was a happy and healthy dog and if, on occasion, I happened to tell her that her bark sounded like a duck quacking, she simply ignored me like any intelligent pup would do. Spencer is a barker and no matter how hard I've tried, I've not been successful at teaching him to curtail it. I had considered having him debarked before he was diagnosed with epilepsy. Now I don't want to take any chances with him with what I would call "elective surgery". But I don't consider debarking inhumane. I spent over ten years both as a employee and as a volunteer at the local SPCA and I know how many dogs are surrendered because they were barkers and their owners either couldn't or wouldn't deal with it.
 
I'm very impressed!

Being new to these forums, I've been reading some of the old topics here. Being very experienced with other doggie discussion groups, when I saw this topic, I thought "Uh-Oh!". I've seen this topic rapidly degenerate into flame wars and generally nasty back and forth. It's right up there with "Which dog food is the best?" for getting 'enthusiastic' responses. However, everyone here was cool, calm and collected... a real pleasure. It's nice to have honest-to-God discussions about such potentially inflammatory subjects. It's a real testament to the caliber of participants in the Sheltie Forums.

Oh- my opinion? I think we have too much government in our lives already. Let's leave this decision up to the dog owner. I've never done it, can't really imagine doing it... but I don't want someone telling me I *can't* do it if I decide it's necessary.
 
[/QUOTE]what is this world coming too. this is why more and more rediculous laws are put into place to satisfy the complainers, when in reality they will never be satisfied people who complain will always find something to complain about. and what does legislation do? they write another bogus law. it totally infuriates me. so what happens. people like us who go about our business get screwed and in the end so do the dogs. this is when poeple need to stand up in a whole and in numbers and speek up. let your voices be heard not give in to this crap[/QUOTE]


I agree wholeheartedly. I think our Founding Fathers would ROLL OVER IN THEIR GRAVES if they could hear people literally ASKING for laws or classes to regulate their actions and their lives, and asking to stipulate how and to what amount they can find their own happiness. It is beyond shocking. Untold people have died so we could live free and without being lorded over, and you have people just begging to give it away.
Just one of the reasons I am on the track to law school. :wink2: so I can help stand up and fight people regulating our right to make our own personal choices, whatever choice that may be!
 
davemize said:
Oh- my opinion? I think we have too much government in our lives already. Let's leave this decision up to the dog owner. I've never done it, can't really imagine doing it... but I don't want someone telling me I *can't* do it if I decide it's necessary.
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Right on the money Dave, you are wise person indeed. :yes:


Oh- for the record, I have done it with my excessive barkers-my dogs dont' bark from boredom, they bark because---- they see squirrels, chipmunks, rabbits running, birds, the electric guy, the neighbors driving down the drive, the niece driving down the drive, the niece driving down the drive again, and again, and again, the wind banging a pipe near the woodburner, someone ringing the doorbell, the son driving into the drive, the son leaving the drive, someone on the porch, another dog barking over on the other road, the son driving down the drive again... um... get my drift???????
My father lives up by the road near us, and if it makes his time outdoors more enjoyable not to hear the echo of my dogs bark- then that is absolutely what I will do- to be a considerate and responsible dog owner.

So I have done it, and will absolutely do it again if need be.
 
Debark

I said before Shadow was debarked but you would never know it. He stills drives me insane and if an intruder tried to break in his bark is loud enough to wake everyone.The other day I was at the beach and a few people were standing around and I was within ear shot to hear them say very rudely that I had his voice box removed.I went up to them and said this is how rumors get started. You know nothing about debarking. His voice box was not removed.Find something better to gossip about.I doubt I will have Sting done .
 
davemize said:
Being new to these forums, I've been reading some of the old topics here. Being very experienced with other doggie discussion groups, when I saw this topic, I thought "Uh-Oh!". I've seen this topic rapidly degenerate into flame wars and generally nasty back and forth. It's right up there with "Which dog food is the best?" for getting 'enthusiastic' responses. However, everyone here was cool, calm and collected... a real pleasure. It's nice to have honest-to-God discussions about such potentially inflammatory subjects. It's a real testament to the caliber of participants in the Sheltie Forums.
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I think we only almost came to fisticuffs once....but even then we worked it out. It is a great forum, and I love it when we get a good thread going.

Alot of other dog forums are all about "Here's a picture of my dog....do you think he's cute?" or "I'm thinking about getting a tiny-mini-toy-chiayorkie...what colour handbag should I guy to carry him in?"

You won't find alot of that here!
 
jazzyfizzle said:
I agree wholeheartedly. I think our Founding Fathers would ROLL OVER IN THEIR GRAVES if they could hear people literally ASKING for laws or classes to regulate their actions and their lives, and asking to stipulate how and to what amount they can find their own happiness. It is beyond shocking. Untold people have died so we could live free and without being lorded over, and you have people just begging to give it away.
Just one of the reasons I am on the track to law school. :wink2: so I can help stand up and fight people regulating our right to make our own personal choices, whatever choice that may be!
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I want to agree and yet I can't! I think this stems from where I grew up and the country I live in!! We're sooo regulated here many have criticised this and think anyone wanting to live in our country is nuts. There was actually an article on this over the weekend which I found very amusing. We banned chewing gum just so we don't get gunk on our shoes! It's true we give up alot of our freedom but we also live in a happy harmonious state! When we have that many people living on what has been described as a country "the size of a piece of dried up snot" (also "disneyland with death penalty". No joke!), regulation is necessary. (I feel brainwashed suddenly!) :lol:

I'm in the legal line too! If I ever end up in politics it would only be to push through pro-animal regulations (yes, at the expense of people). If all dog owners sit through a mandatory "How to care for and understand your dog 101" class and a "Troubleshooting common dog problems" class, I think we'd see a big improvement in shelter numbers and overall wellbeing of dogs. Too many get into dogs without knowing, caring, realising the problems and responsibilities that come with having one. Push more dog educational "documentaries" and features into primetime tv/newspapers in place of the multitude of stupid "where do I get good food" series (really, ONE IS ENOUGH) we get here. Even if it is on debarking and the procedure, etc! Educate educate educate (with a wee bit of help from legislation)! They make their own decisions but at least we ensure (somewhat) that the decision is an informed one.
 
My first reaction to this thread was to leave it alone... I own a debarked sheltie. I was the one who had her debarked. She was a rescue dog before I adopted her and that is the reason she was in rescue. This girl had a bark so shrill that it was like a knife in the side of the head. After being passed around to three homes and given up because of her bark she came to us as a rescue. She was in three rescue homes before she came to my home. My director and I both worked with her for months with her behaviors and her barking. Her behaviors changed but her explosive bark did not. We worked with her on everything to help socialize her. We worked with her with the sound of thunder, trucks, motorcycles... We did it all! She still goes crazy when I run the electric can opener.. When I decided to keep her I talked at length about having her debarked with my vet. She was less than two years old but he agreed that it should be done. Though he doesn't do the procedure himself he did refer me to a vet that would. She is a happy healthy little girl who still enjoys barking and barking at everything but now her bark is much less shrill. Don't be fooled into believing that it is a painful procedure because it is not. They go through the mouth and do not have to open the throat. I would never do that. I am not a throat slasher. I own three shelties and Lacey-Lou is the only one who has been debarked.

Would I do it again? My answer is yes but not every dog needs to be debarked. Each dog is different and needs to be given a chance to correct that behavior through training. My feelings are that it shouldn't be discounted as a solution when all else fails.

Judy
 
SunChaser said:
My first reaction to this thread was to leave it alone... I own a debarked sheltie. I was the one who had her debarked. She was a rescue dog before I adopted her and that is the reason she was in rescue. This girl had a bark so shrill that it was like a knife in the side of the head. After being passed around to three homes and given up because of her bark she came to us as a rescue. She was in three rescue homes before she came to my home. My director and I both worked with her for months with her behaviors and her barking. Her behaviors changed but her explosive bark did not. We worked with her on everything to help socialize her. We worked with her with the sound of thunder, trucks, motorcycles... We did it all! She still goes crazy when I run the electric can opener.. When I decided to keep her I talked at length about having her debarked with my vet. She was less than two years old but he agreed that it should be done. Though he doesn't do the procedure himself he did refer me to a vet that would. She is a happy healthy little girl who still enjoys barking and barking at everything but now her bark is much less shrill. Don't be fooled into believing that it is a painful procedure because it is not. They go through the mouth and do not have to open the throat. I would never do that. I am not a throat slasher. I own three shelties and Lacey-Lou is the only one who has been debarked.

Would I do it again? My answer is yes but not every dog needs to be debarked. Each dog is different and needs to be given a chance to correct that behavior through training. My feelings are that it shouldn't be discounted as a solution when all else fails.

Judy
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Very well stated Judy and I don't think anyone would ever think less of you for doing. You tried everything before considering the procedure. Again, well said!!
 
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