What does "good food" really mean?

I regularly felt guilty that my dogs are not fed the "premium brand of food". But they are doing great on Diamond hi energy food, vet says they look great, so I guess I shouldn't feel bad. With 5 dogs I can not afford food that is $50 for a 35 pound bag :eek2:

Growing up, I had a dog that was a GSD mix, he lived to be 14 years old. He was kept outside on a chain never saw a vet, no flea control or heartworm medication, and was fed Ol' Roy. Could he have lived longer if he was on better food, and saw a vet? Maybe, but he was healthy and happy all the same.
 
Well, considering I want to do the best for my dogs and I was hearing left and right (at the time) that the Purina dog food was NOT a good brand, I decided it would be in my dog's best interest to switch them to a higher quality food. I wasn't worried about what I could see in their fiscal health, that was fine, it was what I couldn't see and didn't know that worried me (ie their organs). I know now that it probably wasn't the best decision I ever made to switch and that this particular food (Wellness) isn't right for them, but I wouldn't say that I was acting as an alarmist. I worry, yes, who wouldn't. My dogs mean the world to me. I'm just trying to be the best owner and care giver I can be.

Clearly you are a great owner and were trying to do what was best for your dogs. Please do not misunderstand, I respect you for what you did and certainly have no issue with it.
My issue is with the people who say 'Oh no! Purina Dog Chow! Don't you know you are killing your dog? You have to switch now!' To someone whose dog has been doing great on it for many years.
That is not some isolated incident, it is something we have to deal with every day, trying to 'talk people down' and 'defend' why we didn't 'educate' them to switch before.
 
Their dog may have been doing "great" while eating a grocery brand low-grade food, but it might not be because of it and might be in spite of it. At least that's what I, personally, believe.

We'd been feeding Kibbles 'n Bits for years. However, once I researched what by-products really were and how many other unhealthy ingredients were in it, I couldn't bear to continue feeding it to my dogs, if I could afford better. I've done a lot of research on dog food since and found the best food for my dogs that I could find at the price I could afford. Their coats and skin are much better because of it.
 
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If all you're feeding is kibble, I'd go for a good-quality brand; however, that doesn't necessarily imply that it's expensive. For kibble I give Dickens a locally-produced brand called Beaverdam, a "four-star" food that's got good protein (27 percent) and low starch. He's done very nicely with this since puppyhood (the breeder recommended it) and has had no digestive issues to speak of, ever. However, my take on the kibble is that it's really something to fill up his tummy, give him a few vitamins, and make him feel as if he's eaten something. Half of his diet is raw meat, chicken or beef, which ought to ensure that he's getting sufficient protein, which is, I believe, the most critical part of any diet.

The best part of it is that I don't have to spend a lot of time "cooking" for my dog, or agonizing over his feeding.

I do the same thing for myself, essentially. I eat all kinds of things that probably don't do much help in terms of nutrition, but I make sure to get a daily allocation of protein in the form of meat, dairy, eggs and seafood.
 
If all you're feeding is kibble, I'd go for a good-quality brand; however, that doesn't necessarily imply that it's expensive.

I agree. I now feed a 4.5 star-rated grain-free food that's only $35 per 25 pound bag. Their with-grain food is also 4.5 stars and is $35 per 30 pound bag. So you don't have to spend a fortune for good quality kibble - you just have to do your research and find the best fit for your dog and your budget.
 
I think we are all violently agreeing here.

I know dogs that have done well on dog chow. And I know dogs that cannot process chicken or grains.

When my parents had dogs when I was a child, they did not google 'best food for dogs"

But neither when I was growing up did we have concerns about kids with peanut allergies.

I don't know what has changed, but things have changed...and ourselves, and our pets, and our planet is not as tolerant as it once was.

All to say if your food is working, leave it alone. If its not, then there is a wide, wide world of options available,.

p.s. be sure though that your food is working. If your dog seems hungry all the time, has super huge poops, or diarrhea or vomiting, even if only occasional, then you might want to think about it.
 
stirring the pot

I love it when I get to "Stir the Pot". Makes for some funny and interesting reading.

Obviously some of you failed to read between my lines. I didn't say anything about feeding one feed the entire life of an animal. Only that by feeding Purina Chow we never had any problems. There is more than one variety of the Chow dog food.

I have no problem with folks feeding their little darlings whatever they wish. Truthfully, we could afford the expensive feed but I see no reason for spending all that money for fancy stuff that for the most part is also in the Chow.

Don't jump to the conclusion that we pay no attention to the needed nutrients and good body building food.

Someone came to the conclusion also that our dogs die of Old Age but evidently in their mind, they weren't happy or well cared for. You could ask anyone that knows us, you would find that we probably go overboard with the health and Vet visits for our animals.

I have dealt with dogs of all kinds and sizes, horses, cows, sheep, goats, rabbits, and many others domestic and wild. None of them were ever denied a good life. Even a Coddled life some times. LOL

Sure doesn't take much to get the Pet Community riled up. :rolleyes2:
 
I read an article about a year ago, that stated that dogs now live twice as long as they did in the 1970's.

Why? Better nutrition and better vet care.

My first Sheltie, who lived from 1974-1985, was fed Kibbles and Bits. I didn't know any better and I think the food options were much more limited then.

Around 1980, my vet at the time, first mentioned Heartworm disease to me. I remember asking "What are the chances?" and he replied "quite slim", so I didn't even have her on HW prevention. . . and we lived in the country.

My, how times have changed. Thank goodness, we are better educated now.
 
Don't jump to the conclusion that we pay no attention to the needed nutrients and good body building food.

This was exactly the point in my original post, way back at the beginning of this thread:

A food with by-products of any kind or fillers is not a good food, because it's filling your dog up with the equivalent of doggie fast food. Some breeders have fed it for years and swear their dogs thrive on it, and that may be true -- or they may be just lucky. Or they may supplement with something that makes up for the food's deficiency.

Many of the people who tell you they've feed the cheap food for the lives of their dogs don't just feed the junk food. They supplement to make up for what the food is missing. Is that a good deal? Depends on your perspective. You can either add whole table or raw food, spend money on supplements, or feed a quality food to start with that you feed less of and has what your dog needs. I prefer to feed what my dogs need for optimal health without the added stuff that will only make them fat and maybe worse. But it's a choice we each make, based on what's best for us and our dogs.
 
Long post, sorry!

I have no problem with folks feeding their little darlings whatever they wish. Truthfully, we could afford the expensive feed but I see no reason for spending all that money for fancy stuff that for the most part is also in the Chow.

For the most part is also in Chow? Let's compare the "chow" to what some consider high quality dog food.

Here is the ingredient list of a popular supermarket dog food, meaning it can be purchased in the same place you buy your food.
A: Whole grain corn, meat and bone meal, corn gluten meal, animal fat preserved with mixed-tocopherols, soybean meal, poultry by-product meal, egg and chicken flavor, whole grain wheat, animal digest, salt, calcium carbonate, potassium chloride, dicalcium phosphate, choline chloride, zinc sulfate, Yellow 6, Vitamin E supplement, L-Lysine monohydrochloride, ferrous sulfate, Yellow 5, Red 40, manganese sulfate, niacin, Blue 2, Vitamin A supplement, copper sulfate, calcium pantothenate, garlic oil, pyridoxine hydrochloride, Vitamin B-12 supplement, thiamine mononitrate, Vitamin D-3 supplement, riboflavin supplement, calcium iodate, menadione sodium bisulfite complex (source of Vitamin K activity), folic acid, biotin, sodium selenite. B-4101

The first ingredient is corn. Dog food ingredients are listed by weight, so that means corn is the main ingredient of that food. Good luck finding any scientific study that states dogs can thrive (not survive) on a diet of mostly corn their whole lives. The next ingredient is meat and bone meal. The animal that the meat and bone is from isn't even specified. That means one of two things, they do not want you to know what animal it is or it is unfit for even human consumption. Personally, I am not comfortable feeding my dog anything that is unfit for me to eat. Here is a quote from dogfoodadvisor on unspecified meats: "Low-grade meals come from anonymous materials like slaughterhouse waste and spoiled supermarket meats — even diseased or dying cattle — or dead zoo animals" http://www.dogfoodadvisor.com/choosing-dog-food/about-meat-meal/

After that you have more corn and more unspecified animal products. There is poultry by-product. Again, what kind of poultry? By-products are a whole other game. It's usually the beaks, feet and feathers. Not much substance there. No fruits or veggies. There is wheat and more unspecified animal ingredients. Lastly, there are artificial flavors, coloring, and preservatives. Artificial chemicals are always good, right?

Here is one of the higher rated brands that are more expensive and sold at specialty pet stores:
B: Chicken meal, steel-cut oats, deboned chicken, whole potato, peas, chicken fat, whole egg, deboned flounder, sun-cured alfalfa, chicken liver, herring oil, pea fiber, whole apples, whole pears, sweet potato, pumpkin, butternut squash, parsnips, carrots, spinach, cranberries, blueberries, kelp, chicory root, juniper berries, angelica root, marigold flowers, sweet fennel, peppermint leaf, lavender, Vitamin A supplement, vitamin D3 supplement, vitamin E supplement, niacin, riboflavin, folic acid, biotin, vitamin B12 supplement, zinc proteinate, iron proteinate, manganese proteinate, copper proteinate, selenium yeast, dried Enterococcus faecium fermentation product.

Chicken meal is the first ingredient. Good start! Because "meal" means the water is removed, so this is all chicken meat. All meats on the ingredient list specify exactly what animal it is from. Nothing says just "meat or poultry." It even species the exact fish, flounder and herring oil. There are fruits & veggies. It might be too much oats, potatoes and peas for some people's preference, but looks like a nice amount of meat. No corn or grains. And NO artificial chemicals, colors and flavors.

The only thing I see similar between the "chow" and expensive brand are the added vitamin supplements.

Assuming most dogs eat the same meal their whole life, what do you think eating all these artificial chemicals, corn and the lowest quality who knows what meat could be doing to their bodies? Why do dogs even need artificial colors? It's only added to please us humans. Your dog does not care. Imagine if you ate Hot Pockets your entire life? PS: Hot Pockets, who own a supermarket brand of dog food were recently recalled for having unfit for human consumption meat in their Hot Pockets. If that's how they produce human food, imagine what goes into the dog food!

ARGGGHH!
Ok, as this one has touched a deep nerve with me, I'm going to ignore the very sound advice on my signature and jump in. I almost wish I could get permission to repost this post on my website.
Whenever I see a new client I always ask, of course, what they are feeding. And if, say, a seven year old dog is doing well- good weight, good coat, no allergies, good stools, good appetite, and is on a decent food like Purina, Beneful, Pedigree, I would NEVER suggest that they 'upgrade' to something better with 'better ingredients.' And I wish the busybodies would stop doing that as well. Now, if you are starting out with a puppy - sure, we can discuss the relative merits of foods. If there is any sort of problem, of course, 'upgrading' food is the ultimate in natural, holistic health improvement.
But this idea that people whose dogs are doing just fine have to keep searching for the Utopian absolutely best possible food is alarmist and harmful. This poster's experiences are a perfect example of the problems that such 'advice' can provoke.

If I bring my dog to my veterinarian and tell him what food I feed and he knows there are better opinions out there, but doesn't inform me because on the outside my dog looks healthy, I would be pissed. I am paying you to take care of my dog and inform me of the healthiest ways to raise her. I would want to know if there are better options and not have it be withheld because at that moment my dog looks good.

So you suggest waiting until a dog has health issues to upgrade? That could end up being too late. I would assume veterinarians would want to prevent problems before they occur. Isn't that why we use things like tick/flea protection? So feed kibble loaded with corn, little to no meat and chemicals as long as they appear healthy and then if after all those years of artificial chemicals finally catches up to them, then suggest upgrading?

To me that's like if a smoker went to his doctor and his check up and bloodwork were normal and the doctor says "well you're healthy now, so continue smoking and if you start to show signs of breathing issues, then we'll discuss helping you quit."

I'd just like to point out, I don't go shouting from rooftops or telling random people or even my close friends what to feed their dogs. I'm not one of those people that needs to convert everyone. I know not everyone can afford the expensive stuff. Heck, if I had more than one dog, I wouldn't be able to afford to feed the food I am feeding right now. I'm just happy to know as much as I do and made an informed decision for my dog. I have a friend who feeds one of the lowest quality dog foods to all her dogs and her two oldest have lived long and mostly healthy lives. If they were on better food, could they have lived even longer? Who knows! To each their own. We just all do the best we can for our dogs.
 
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