And the puppy search is on!

Oh man, how can you not drool over these puppies???? I choose the girl on the far right! She looks like she's bigger and has a really sweet face.

Puppy fever!!!! Good luck, it will be fun to hear about you meeting this really adorable collection of pups.

Sharon
 
Well, we visited breeder #1 yesterday. I'm still not too sure what to think, but I was mostly underwhelmed. I don't know if my expectations were too high, or we were just spoiled by the quality of our first 2 sheltie puppies(our first breeder is no longer breeding :cry:). It made me feel a little discouraged about the puppy search.

The puppies were of course super cute. But I felt they were a little on the small side for the age of 9 weeks. There was one puppy that we felt a connection with, but the breeder insisted that we needed a 'backup' puppy choice, b/c there was someone coming later in the week that has first dibs on a puppy. The breeder seemed kind of insulted when we implied that we didn't think any of the other puppies were what we were looking for based on size (they were going to be small shelties, about 13").

What we are looking for is really a 'show quality' dog in terms of conformation that only has minor faults (not a full white collar, slightly oversize etc). We love a beautiful dog (I feel like a horrible person saying that b/c it feels so superficial). But in addition to a fabulous temperament, looks for a sheltie really are important to us. It's one of the reasons were are looking for a puppy from a reputable breeder, instead of trying to go through a resuce (amoung many other reasons).

But, I feel when I say we are looking for a 'pet' we are not giving an accurate representation of what we realy want. I hesitate to say 'show quality' or 'close to show quality', b/c we don't want to show or breed. I know breeders produce puppies with the intent of 'bettering' the breed, so I don't want to presume that they would sell a close to conformation quality dog to a pet home.

I guess this is more of a vent. And I suppose a question to any of the breeders on the forum in the opposite position. I felt SO awful when I was telling this breeder that I didn't think any of her other puppies would work based mainly on their size and delicate bone structure. I felt like I was saying her children are ugly. :cry: But I am trying to be honest, and finding the puppy that is right for us.

Does anyone have any advice about how I can possibly approach breeders in the future, and accurately represent what we are searching for?
 
Here is a thought....If you go on different breeder's websites, you will start to see the differences in the family lines. Hone in on a "family" of dogs you like. Then, contact that breeder. If they don't have any puppies available at that time, you could ask who has recently bred to their stud dogs, and may have a puppy available (still keeping in the vein of the family you like). So, to keep this less confusing for you, find the "look" that you like in a sheltie. Then when the breeder shows you their puppies, you can imagine what they will look like as an adult. Your puppy may be a companion puppy, not show quality, but it will look like what you favor. Our dogs look like their family, so a puppy of ours is easy to imagine as an adult.
You can start seeing different breeder's dogs by going on sheltiesonline.com.
 
dufournf4 said:
What we are looking for is really a 'show quality' dog in terms of conformation that only has minor faults (not a full white collar, slightly oversize etc). We love a beautiful dog (I feel like a horrible person saying that b/c it feels so superficial). But in addition to a fabulous temperament, looks for a sheltie really are important to us. It's one of the reasons were are looking for a puppy from a reputable breeder, instead of trying to go through a resuce (amoung many other reasons).

...

Does anyone have any advice about how I can possibly approach breeders in the future, and accurately represent what we are searching for?
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I would seriously encourage you to consider bringing home a "retired" show dog. Every breeder has dogs who they show to their championships, but who aren't going to be a part of the breeding program. It's nice if the breeder has room for these guys to become sofa dogs, but it's really nice if the breeder can find a good family for them. It's tricky to ;predict exactly how short of the Standard an eight-week-old puppy is going to fall: it's very difficult for a breeder to guarantee you that the puppy you're buying is going to be "only a teensy bit" pet-quality. (Likewise, given the years of study and focus that breeders put into learning to pick puppies, it's probably going to be difficult for you to come in and evaluate a breeder's litter.) Usually what happens is this: the obviously pet-quality puppies are sold at ten weeks. These are the ones who definitely won't make it - hugely over/undersize, bad heads, snipey muzzles. The breeder hangs onto two or three puppies for a little longer. If one starts falling off, they're sold, but they're a little older now. The puppies who stay the longest are the ones who have the highest quality, but they may still get to the point where they're nice enough to show but not really what the breeder wants to breed from. And that's where you come in.

You would get your "show-quality", good-looking dog. And you can even brag to friends and neighbors that s/he is a champion! Plus, your new pet will be already housebroken and past the age of the usual puppy vices. The breeder doesn't mind selling you a nice dog, because the dog's job in the show-ring is done (and breeding duties are not in the cards). And the dog gets to be spoiled and loved by you for the rest of his or her days. It's a win-win-win.

OK, so you don't get a puppy. I know a lot of people have misgivings about not getting to raise the puppy themselves - something about a mystical bonding process that can only take place if you get the puppy when it's eight weeks old. Hogwash! My heart-and-soul dog, the dog who I bonded to most closely, came to us when he was two years old. He had had a great life with his breeders, and he was ready and willing to have a great life with us.
 
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tofu pup said:
I would seriously encourage you to consider bringing home a "retired" show dog. Every breeder has dogs who they show to their championships, but who aren't going to be a part of the breeding program. It's nice if the breeder has room for these guys to become sofa dogs, but it's really nice if the breeder can find a good family for them.

You would get your "show-quality", good-looking dog. And you can even brag to friends and neighbors that s/he is a champion! Plus, your new pet will be already housebroken and past the age of the usual puppy vices. The breeder doesn't mind selling you a nice dog, because the dog's job in the show-ring is done (and breeding duties are not in the cards). And the dog gets to be spoiled and loved by you for the rest of his or her days. It's a win-win-win.

OK, so you don't get a puppy. I know a lot of people have misgivings about not getting to raise the puppy themselves - something about a mystical bonding process that can only take place if you get the puppy when it's eight weeks old. Hogwash! My heart-and-soul dog, the dog who I bonded to most closely, came to us when he was two years old. He had had a great life with his breeders, and he was ready and willing to have a great life with us.
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I think this is a great idea but I am biased because it is what we did. We got Mikos at 8 months old, a show potential that grew too tall and he has bonded into our family wonderfully. Brie came to us for her retirement and at 6 years has also fit in beautifully. I will admit that the puppies are the best and I am sure I will go that route one day but I also think that a huge part of what makes shelties beautiful is their eyes and personalities rather than their physical appearance. Good luck with your search.
 
I just wanted to post and say that I know exactly how you feel. I felt similarly when looking for my dogs (and even more so in getting my second dog because I felt like I knew more about the breed). Of course, both of my dogs have faults and would never make it in the conformation ring, but they have sound structure, and lovely sheltie heads. My little girl had an underbite, so she was a perfect fit for us.

I think missjenneygirl had a great suggestion. Find a line or pedigree of dogs that you like. You would be surprised at how closely they all resemble each other. When you find a reputable breeder, you'll see that they have a "look" that they are trying to achieve, and that their puppies (even the companion pups) carry it.

You could even tell the breeder--they love to hear it! "I love the look of your dogs!" Or, "I love the soft expression that all of your dogs seem to have, would you say that these puppies will carry that as well?" Or whatever trait that you really value. I've told my breeder before what kind of sheltie heads I like, and I think she understood.
 
If the puppies aren't right for you, I don't think there's any reason to feel bad about it. I felt like that with the first litter of puppies we went to see. I also got a weird feeling from the breeder because she was trying to be very secretive and hide the dogs from the neighbors... very odd.

We also passed up on a blue merle puppy before we got Buffy, despite the fact that the breeder was extremely helpful and nice. If it doesn't feel right, it's not right. I think it's better to wait for the right puppy and be sure about it than rush into something where you're not 100%. Buying a dog is one of the few chances you have to pick one of your relatives. And if you want a cute dog, well, who can blame you? There's plenty of people (like me!) who think the littler puppies are cute. I'm small, so I like that Buffy is too.

I think that it's important to pay attention to the mom when you go to see puppies too. Mom is a very good indicator of temperament, size, conformation, etc. The puppy is an adult for much longer than it is a puppy. Buffy's dam was wandering around while our breeder was explaining her contract and answering our questions, and the mom was such a sweetie. She kept putting her front legs up to be petted. I later learned from this forum that Buffy's sire has a similarly sweet temperament. It makes sense that Buffy is the way she is since she had such good genes from those two.

Also, I pay a lot of attention to the socialization the breeder has done with the puppy. By the time we got Buffy she had been on all kinds of surfaces, was fully transitioned to solid food, was used to being handled, had been around kids, adults, and elderly people, and had all her vaccinations, etc. Some of the key times of socialization pass while at the breeder's, so it was good we had our bases covered there.

Also, at most of the good breeders, even the pet quality puppies are very pretty and cute. I guess it's kind of in the eye of the beholder, but I think Buffy is prettier than many of the show quality dogs I have seen. But of course, that's just me! She can never show because of course, she's too short, and also she has cute little buck teeth. You can only see them if you look closely. I think it adds to her charm. :biggrin2:

By the way, Buffy was our first choice when we looked at the puppies, but there were 3 people in front of us to pick their girls first. I was certain one of them would take her, and I was worried that we would end up with one of those other puppies instead. (The whole week before I probably drove my husband crazy.) Anyway, it worked out in the end, so we were very lucky. But sometimes things are just meant to be.
 
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