Dominance and Dog Training
- Thread starter Toffee's Mom
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Toffee's Mom
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Toffee's Mom
Forums Sage
I have always wanted to Clicker train, but as I have said before ..........
I can't walk and chew gum at the same time.I would never be able to mark at the right moment, but I am so envious of you that are graceful.
You are hilarious hahahaha
Me and graceful are two words that should NEVER be combined in a sentence LOLHaving said that the way Triple M the terror listens to you says that you DO HAVE IT! If you can say the word yes, you can clicker train, lol It's honestly so much LESS complicated than I EVER thought, and you really can't do much wrong, even if you do there is NO damage done! The honest to goodness reason I was 'converted' so quickly was Smudge and her posting in a couple of threads in here! That is when I said you know what!?? I am FINALLY gonna try it, lol. SO thanks Forum and Jessica and Smudge for creating this, it's really all kinda her fault !! LOL
LOL!Ainsley's mom
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Shelties are a sensitive breed, but like any characteristic it varies along a continuum from extremely sensitive to quite bold. I feel that training methods need to be based on the needs of the individual dog as well as the age and stage of development when you are training.
I have always started training as soon as I had a puppy home--usually at 8-10 weeks. You can't expect a pup that young to respond the same way as an older pup. I do a lot of positive reinforcement and behavior shaping at this time. For example, if I am working on "come" I will praise even a couple of steps in my direction and lots of petting and treats when he gets to me. At this point I try to make it a game for the pup. (I only work on come and sit at this age.) Having said that, I do use a stronger, no nonsense voice for NO to stop unwanted behavior.
When a pup is older, however, I feel that you need to be a bit more assertive--I prefer the term assertive as that doesn't have the negative connotations of dominant and more accurately describes a better trainer attitude IMO. Dogs will test you to see what they can get away with--especially in that adolescent "you're not the boss of me" phase. At that point it seems to work better to be firm--not harsh, but no nonsense. Otherwise you may end up with a spoiled, obnoxious dog that no one wants to be around, including you. Even an adult dog may need an occasional reminder of who is in charge.
As long as you are training by considering the individual personality and sensitivity levels of the particular dog, I think there is room for a number of training methods to be successful. Use what works for you and your dog.
I have always started training as soon as I had a puppy home--usually at 8-10 weeks. You can't expect a pup that young to respond the same way as an older pup. I do a lot of positive reinforcement and behavior shaping at this time. For example, if I am working on "come" I will praise even a couple of steps in my direction and lots of petting and treats when he gets to me. At this point I try to make it a game for the pup. (I only work on come and sit at this age.) Having said that, I do use a stronger, no nonsense voice for NO to stop unwanted behavior.
When a pup is older, however, I feel that you need to be a bit more assertive--I prefer the term assertive as that doesn't have the negative connotations of dominant and more accurately describes a better trainer attitude IMO. Dogs will test you to see what they can get away with--especially in that adolescent "you're not the boss of me" phase. At that point it seems to work better to be firm--not harsh, but no nonsense. Otherwise you may end up with a spoiled, obnoxious dog that no one wants to be around, including you. Even an adult dog may need an occasional reminder of who is in charge.
As long as you are training by considering the individual personality and sensitivity levels of the particular dog, I think there is room for a number of training methods to be successful. Use what works for you and your dog.
It is funny because "yes" is exactly what I say when I get what I want, followed by "good boy."
The other thing is too with me, is I am always in training mode with MMM. I can be in the garden weeding, and I will call MMM to just come to me. When I see him flying across the field, I will say, "Under" and he is to go under the 1st rail of the horse fence, or "Over" the first rail. I never stop weeding as long as he does the right one. I couldn't have a clicker in my hand. Or I may have the wheel barrow going and I want for him to come and touch my hand. So I just mark the behavior with a "yes and then verbal praise."
I only stop what I am doing if he needs to revisit the command.
The other thing is too with me, is I am always in training mode with MMM. I can be in the garden weeding, and I will call MMM to just come to me. When I see him flying across the field, I will say, "Under" and he is to go under the 1st rail of the horse fence, or "Over" the first rail. I never stop weeding as long as he does the right one. I couldn't have a clicker in my hand. Or I may have the wheel barrow going and I want for him to come and touch my hand. So I just mark the behavior with a "yes and then verbal praise."
I only stop what I am doing if he needs to revisit the command.
Toffee's Mom
Forums Sage
lol
there you go, clicker training without the clicker
I LOVE it, and heeeeere he comes barreling down and is in no way shape or form intimidated by you, lol. SO all is as it should be!!I am really just objecting to the people who have their dog cower in front of them, followed by more hollering....
That's what I meant to say in my post, lol. You say it better! Get out of my head!
Toffee's Mom
Forums Sage
That's what I meant to say in my post, lol. You say it better! Get out of my head!
lol Lahree! that IS what you said in your post
Just errr a little more clearly communicated hahaha, just kidding yours was errr clear at some parts, hahaha NOT that I should be talking, but I love to razz ya 
AND
Why isn't Ron being woken up in this loving manner, Jan??
When we got Ellie it had been about 14 years since we had a puppy. As we were waiting for her to become old enough to bring home (we put a deposit down on her sight-unseen on the day she was born), I ordered every kind of positive re-enforcement book on the market I think. I re ad them all and that, along with having two other Shelties who lived to advanced ages, I thought would prepare me for a new puppy. Nope. Not THIS puppy! 
My first dog, Honey, was so sensitive that she became visibly upset if people used swear words! You could even say swear words in a sing-song voice, or a gentle voice, excited voice or a whisper and she could pick them out!
The bottom line is--you have to use the POSITIVE methods that word best for your individual dog. It's like a bratty kid--if you don't tell them no, they will continue to misbehave and become out of control. Sometimes it takes a loooonnnngggggggggg time to figure out what works with your dog and what doesn't. The living example of that is laying at my feet.
My first dog, Honey, was so sensitive that she became visibly upset if people used swear words! You could even say swear words in a sing-song voice, or a gentle voice, excited voice or a whisper and she could pick them out!The bottom line is--you have to use the POSITIVE methods that word best for your individual dog. It's like a bratty kid--if you don't tell them no, they will continue to misbehave and become out of control. Sometimes it takes a loooonnnngggggggggg time to figure out what works with your dog and what doesn't. The living example of that is laying at my feet.