High Protein/Low Protein HELP

Ann said:
You are right on target. All the vets and nutritionists that I work with believe that maximum protein should be in the 20 percent range. If your dog has ever shown borderline liver or kidney values on bloodwork, they like to see it in the low 20's, tops. I feed three different foods to my three Shelties for that reason...they each have different needs. But I'm careful never to let the protein level get above the 20 percents. You generally won't see the results of cumulative kidney issues until they're older, and then it's tough to reverse.
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Some dogs seem to handle protein ok, some do not. To my knowledge, dogs are not carnivors, but omnivors, so they can have grain in their diets, assuming the grain is of high quality. Some dogs can't tolerate grains, so in IMO, that's where grain free, high protein foods can come in handy.

Sadie does not tolerate high protein foods. I dealt with severe diarrhea and vomiting on and off for months, all testing and blood work she had came back inconclusive, but it appeared she may have been having trouble with low grade, chronic pancreatitis. This is caused by too much fat and protein in her diet. She was not on a high protein food, over weight, old (as in most cases. She was only a year old) and didn't eat that much junky food.

She was on a vet food for almost a year, which helped her diarrhea and vomiting but left her skin and coat itchy and dry and she was constipated.

I switched her to Wellness Super5Mix based on the fat and protein content (it was comparable to the vet food) and have not had a problem with her since. She's no longer constipated and her skin and coat look better than they've ever looked.
 
SheltieGuy said:
Protein VS LIVER


http://home.att.net/~wdcusick/protein.html

http://www.dogaware.com/specific.html#liver

http://www.ehow.com/about_5221016_low-diet-dogs-liver-problems.html

http://www.dog-health-guide.org/doghealthliver.html
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Fantastic articles! I did alot of research and did not find these ones.

The 2nd one was of particular interest to me as it quoted that dental problems can also lead to high ALT levels! Well, the whole experience for me started the morning that Bacca's mouth had swollen up to the size of a ping pong ball!
 
Smudge said:
Hey Barb, how old is Bacca? Also, how old was he when you had his thyroid tested?
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He's 21 months old now, and was tested back in September, so about 17 months - not specifically looking for thyroid because he had no symptoms other than the fact that he had been off and on his food since June, his face was lop-sided and we never had a proper diagnosis for his facial swelling in June.

Then the test in September indicated slightly elevated ALT and ALS levels as well as thyroid. Then he was rested again in December and his ALT had gone through the roof - about quadruple normal levels.
 
After talking to my vet I am still not convinced that long term feeding of high protein food has no influence on kidney function.I think a rotation of high/low may be better.
What are your opinions?
Has anyone else asked their vet?
 
I think the main question to ask yourself is - WHAT are you looking to do with your dog?

If you are just looking for a "home body" dog that goes out for the daily walk/run, plays around the house, and cuddles, then you probably DO NOT need a high protein food.

If you are looking into getting involved with dog sports such as agility, flyball, or herding ... the more active sports ... then you may want the higher protein foods ONCE YOU START training/competing.

Based on everything I've read on these high vs. low protein discussions here and the various links posted and talking to my groomer, who breeds Shelties for show and performance, I've come to this conclusion:

Protein to dogs is equivalent to Carbs for humans.​

Carbs, in a human, are energy. Energy drinks, including things like Gatorade, are high in sugar because sugar IS a carbohydrate; it's energy for the human body. If you aren't participating in an event where you need the extra energy provided by the carbs then don't eat/drink them. If you do, the result is weight gain because of unburned calories.

The same can be said for dogs. Protein is energy for dogs in the same way carbs are energy for people. If they don't need the extra energy (Protein) because of some activity they are involved in, don't feed it to them. Stick with lower (mid-20%) protein foods.

I'm transitioning Edan to TOTW High Prairie formula, one of the high protein formulas, because we run agility. We train at our club twice a week plus practice at home. We also compete in agility trials. I'm HOPING the higher protein will help prevent him from being so totally worn out at the end of the day. (We were using Eagle Pack Holistic Chicken and Rice which was a 24% protein content but not grain free. I STILL highly recommend this food.) When we are no longer competing, I'll drop Edan back to a lower protein food again.

So, again, ask yourself what are you going to do with your dog and use that to guide your judgment. As you've seen, you'll NEVER really get a clear answer. The "what are we going to do" question at least gives you a foundation to base your decision on. Whether you go with high or low protein, if you select a higher quality food, you really can't go wrong.

(NOTE: This is all assuming no known medical issues. Medical issues change the scenario; and you can only make decisions based on KNOWN medical issues. If you try to make a decision based on "what ifs" you'll never get anywhere. Make a decision and adjust if something comes up.)
 
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My dogs are young and very active. They do some type of physical activity every day that I believe is higher than the norm. So a higher protein diet is recommended by our vet.

I think we said it before...but I will say it again. This is a personal decision based on what your dogs personal needs are. There is no one diet that is perfect for every dog and every situation.

If you are afraid of high protein CAUSING Kidney problems....they don't feed it.
 
Silaria said:
I think the main question to ask yourself is - WHAT are you looking to do with your dog?

If you are just looking for a "home body" dog that goes out for the daily walk/run, plays around the house, and cuddles, then you probably DO NOT need a high protein food.

If you are looking into getting involved with dog sports such as agility, flyball, or herding ... the more active sports ... then you may want the higher protein foods ONCE YOU START training/competing.

Based on everything I've read on these high vs. low protein discussions here and the various links posted and talking to my groomer, who breeds Shelties for show and performance, I've come to this conclusion:

Protein to dogs is equivalent to Carbs for humans.​

Carbs, in a human, are energy. Energy drinks, including things like Gatorade, are high in sugar because sugar IS a carbohydrate; it's energy for the human body. If you aren't participating in an event where you need the extra energy provided by the carbs then don't eat/drink them. If you do, the result is weight gain because of unburned calories.

The same can be said for dogs. Protein is energy for dogs in the same way carbs are energy for people. If they don't need the extra energy (Protein) because of some activity they are involved in, don't feed it to them. Stick with lower (mid-20%) protein foods.

I'm transitioning Edan to TOTW High Prairie formula, one of the high protein formulas, because we run agility. We train at our club twice a week plus practice at home. We also compete in agility trials. I'm HOPING the higher protein will help prevent him from being so totally worn out at the end of the day. (We were using Eagle Pack Holistic Chicken and Rice which was a 24% protein content but not grain free. I STILL highly recommend this food.) When we are no longer competing, I'll drop Edan back to a lower protein food again.

So, again, ask yourself what are you going to do with your dog and use that to guide your judgment. As you've seen, you'll NEVER really get a clear answer. The "what are we going to do" question at least gives you a foundation to base your decision on. Whether you go with high or low protein, if you select a higher quality food, you really can't go wrong.

(NOTE: This is all assuming no known medical issues. Medical issues change the scenario; and you can only make decisions based on KNOWN medical issues. If you try to make a decision based on "what ifs" you'll never get anywhere. Make a decision and adjust if something comes up.)
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Excellent post, I appreciated the info and read :wink2:
 
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